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« The seashore's off-ro… | Home | Final ORV rule will b… »

The new normal: Where we can drive and where we cannot

Monday 30 January 2012 at 5:00 pm.

My son was here this past weekend to help me with cataract surgery.  On Saturday, the day after the surgery, the day was sunny and unseasonably warm, so we took a late afternoon drive on the beach.

We made our last trip by vehicle from Ramp 49 in Frisco to Cape Point.

It’s a favorite beach “tour” for many islanders and visitors.  It’s about 5 miles from Ramp 49 to Ramp 44 north of Cape Point.  As usual, we stopped along the way to get out and walk, do some shelling, watch the dolphins frolicking in the breakers and the birds that were everywhere.

We got to the Point just about sunset and watched the sun sink into the western horizon and the sky turn bright colors of pink and orange.

I can’t tell you how many times I’ve made that drive, and it was difficult to think that this would be the last one.  Soon, 1.7 miles of beach between Ramp 49 and the Point, will become a vehicle-free area year round.  That is basically in the popular area known as the Hook.

When the National Park Service final rule for off-road vehicles for the Cape Hatteras National Seashore becomes effective on Feb. 15, we will have to learn some new habits about beach driving on the beach and say goodbye to some old ones – like driving on the beach for free.

There are some places, such as the Hook, we’re used to driving that we will not drive again.

Some of them are places near and dear to our hearts, favorite places for surf fishing, shelling, surfing, and for families to bring a day’s worth of gear and hang out, fish, swim, cook dinner, and have a bonfire on the beach.

Our access to our favorite places, such as the points and spits, will be much more limited, with portions of all reserved as vehicle-free areas.

Some of the favorite places have been off limits during nesting season, but we’re talking about year-round under the final rule.

The environmentalists and their supporters who drove the agenda for the new rule don’t see a thing wrong with any of this.  They think we are a bunch of cry babies who care more about fun than “baby” birds and turtles.

This is not so.  What we are gearing up for is a major change in our traditional, historical, and cultural uses of the Hatteras and Ocracoke beaches – the ways folks who have lived here have always accessed the beach.

We want to be stewards of the environment, but we also want to use the beach as we always have and feel we always should.  We don’t think the two are mutually exclusive, but that battle has been fought and lost.

So here’s a bit of a guide to the new ORV routes and areas and where we can drive, not drive, or walk.

Just remember that you won’t be able to drive on these routes all the time – even the routes that are called “year-round.” Nor will you be able to walk in vehicle-free areas if birds and turtles are nesting there.

At the end of this blog, you can click on a mile-by-mile chart of the seashore that spells out the year-round ORV routes, seasonal ORV routes, and the vehicle-free areas (VFAs).

Here is a brief summary of the 26.4 miles of year-round VFAs from Bodie Island through Ocracoke:

  • Ramp 1 to half a mile south of Coquina Beach. 1.7 miles.
  • Southeast corner of Bodie Island spit along the inlet shoreline to the southwest edge of the Bait Pond. Eight-tenths of a mile.
  • Rodanthe boundary to one-tenth of a miles south of Rodanthe Pier – 1.6 miles.
  • Ramp 23 south of Salvo to 1.5 miles south of Ramp 23.  1.5 miles.
  • Ramp 27 to Ramp 30 between Salvo and Avon. 2.2 miles.
  • New Ramp 32.5 to Ramp 34. Between Salvo and Avon. 2 miles.
  • 1.5 miles south of Ramp 38, which is south of Avon, to four-tenths of a mile north of Ramp 43, which is south of Buxton.  4.1 miles.
  • Three-tenths of a mile west of Cape Point to 1.7 miles west of Ramp 45.  This is the area called the Hook. 2.8 miles.
  • Sandy Bay/Frisco Day Use Area (west of Frisco boundary) to east Hatteras village boundary. 1.4 miles.
  • Bone Road off the Pole Road to Hatteras Inlet and along the inlet shoreline to Spur Road. 1 mile. This includes the area at the tip of the Hatteras Inlet shoreline sometimes known as False Point.
  • Hatteras Inlet to new Ramp 59.5 on Ocracoke.  This includes the North Point of that island. 1.6 miles.
  • New Ramp 63 on Ocracoke to 1 mile northeast of Ramp 67. 2.5 miles.
  • Ramp 68 to four-tenths of a mile northeast of Ramp 70. 2.2 miles.
  • The inlet shoreline at Ocracoke’s South Point. 1 mile.

You can see the current and planned new ramps on the seven maps that detail the year-round and seasonal ORV routes.

There are 28 miles of year-round ORV routes in the seashore, but they are subject to nesting closures.

The 13 miles of seasonal ORV closures are basically in front of the villages and a few other areas, such as Bodie Island spit and the Ocracoke campground.

The areas we will be able to drive, subject to resource closures, are clearly outlined in the seven maps of the seashore that are in the Final Environmental Impact statement.

There were no changes in the basic ORV routes in the final rule.  There were a few adjustments, including more clearly delineating routes at Hatteras spit as a result of changes caused by Hurricane Irene and declaring that Ramp 59 on Ocracoke will be an ORV ramp until the new 59.5 is built.

When you look at the maps, remember that the green broken line indicates a year-round ORV route and the red broken line indicates a seasonal route.  Where you see shoreline with no red or green lines, it’s closed year-round as a vehicle-free area.

We will all learn to live by the new regulations, and we must keep reminding ourselves that it could have been worse. 

There are still 28 miles of year-round ORV routes.  During the spring and summer nesting season, ORV access will be pretty much what is has been in recent years.

There will continue to be beaches we can drive to – just maybe not the ones we’d prefer to drive to.

And stay tuned for more information on permits that the Park Service has said it will release before Feb. 15.  We presume that will include information on the cost of the permits and when they will go on sale.

FOR MORE INFORMATION

Click here for a chart of year-round and seasonal ORV routes and areas and vehicle-free areas.

Click here for seven seashore maps of year-round and seasonal ORV routes.

Updated maps of the seashore with ORV routes and vehicle-free areas and frequently asked questions about the rules should be available soon on the Cape Hatteras National seashore website, www.nps.gov/caha.

170 comments

Bill Stavenger

All the meetings and the outcome is as bad or worse as what was expected from day one. Good bye national seashore and recreation area, Hello special interest group refuge. Anybody for fox and racoon hunting with the NPS?
Bill Stavenger
Chesapeake,VA (former Buxton Oaks Trailer Park renter).

Bill Stavenger (Email ) - 30-01-’12 17:53
Jeanie Wright

Curious. Will the trailers where we are to purchase the passes and view the indoctrination film be handicapped accessible? They better be! And will we be able to take advantage of the handicapped passes for national parks?

Jeanie Wright (Email ) - 30-01-’12 18:09
Bobby Hilliard

Jeanie I have seen the collection trailer near ramp 2. It does handicap access. So I’m figuring the other 2 trailers also have handicap access.

Bobby Hilliard - 30-01-’12 19:00
7ounce

Makes me sick. That VFA from ramp 27 to ramp 30 is some of the best fall fishing on HI. I still don’t understand the need for these VFAs. Pea Island is a VFA, you want a VFA experience go there. If I want an inlet experience I have to drive to Hatteras Inlet, oh wait, can’t do that anymore…

7ounce - 30-01-’12 19:00
Dewey Parr

Irene Nolan, in her Blogs, has summed up the heartbreak and turmoil that we who reside on Hatteras Island have endured over the last three years. It is true that much of the problem of businesses has been the decline in the economy. You cannot discount the extreme financial loss to small family owned businesses because of a lack of customers due to the beach closing controversy. Our little business at the Old Gray House was a happy flourishing business prior to beach closing. The majority of those who took the time to venture off of Hwy 12 and come down Light Plant Road to our shop over the last twenty years became our friends. Each year when they visited the Island they returned to see us as if we were family. Mary and I watched many of their children grow up. We have also had the pleasure of having those same children return to visit with us with their families. It has been Mary’s pleasure to hold and hug their babies. This closeness is the difference you find between small businesses on Hatteras and Ocracoke Island and other tourist areas. When you visit us you become part of our Island family. At the Old Gray House we have come to love each and everyone who has come to visit with us. Now to watch that family of friends go away and say they will never come back to the Islands has hurt us even more than seeing our free and open access to the beach taken away by the National Park Service. It is true that I have been very vocal about what the Audubon Society, Defenders of Wildlife, and the NPS have done to the Islands. My outcry was prompted, not so much about driving on the beach, as it was the eroding of our freedoms and breaking past promises by our government officials to maintain free and open access to the beach and to maintain the dune system on the Islands. I will also have to admit my displeasure was prompted by the fact the National Park took away my greatest pleasure in life when they closed South Beach. Everyday of my life when it was possible I made my way to a designated spot on the South Beach at sunrise. It was there I viewed what I considered to be the most magical moment on earth. I sought counsel from my Creator to carry me through the day. In all of my travels I have never witnessed anything to compare with the secrets of sunrise on Hatteras South Beach. It almost broke my heart at the time to know that I will not be able to enjoy that summer time pleasure again.
Now I have concluded that the beach access issue is all over. I am resolved to making the best of what I have left to enjoy. You know folks there comes a time to fold or a time to stop riding a horse to death. It is over. It was a done deal. From the start we all knew it but we did not want to admit it. Through it all we have learned what we knew from the beginning. Our government no longer represents the wishes of the people and the majority of politicians have sold their souls to the highest bidders. Am I cynical of our leaders? Yes. But even so I still believe in the American system as instituted by our founding fathers and feel it is worth fighting for. Our only hope is that someday those babies Mary has hugged at the Old Gray House will restore our great country back to what it used to be, the Home of the Brave and the Land of the Free.
I would like to say to those who are spewing out hate for the Audubon Society, Defenders of Wildlife and the Administration and employees of the Cape Hatteras National Recreational Park that there is nothing to gain by doing so. The employees of the National Park System in particular are merely pawns on the chessboard of life. They are individuals who are working for a living. Those on the local level either do what they are told to do or they do not have a job. They should not be blamed or held accountable for the actions of the hierarchy of the NPS. To treat them unjustly is not the proper thing to do. They are friends and neighbors and if they had their way things would be different. It has been our policy at the Old Gray House from the beginning of this issue to welcome all who walk in our doors. We have never denied anyone access to our small business nor do we ever intend to do so because they are in disagreement with our views. Nor have we intentionally picked a verbal battle with anyone concerning their beliefs on any subject especially beach access.
I learned a long time ago, as a child on Hatteras Island, that the mark of an educated person was their willingness to listen to the others person’s views on any subject. We do not have to be in agreement to be friends. This has always been one of the codes of the Island. To let our individual views of beach access be our criteria for friendship is not in accordance with the code of these Islands that have always been known for their freedom of expression.
After reading all the comments in Irene Nolan’s Blog, from those who have been our friends over the years, saying they are not coming back to the Island I am not sure how much longer Mary and I will continue to keep the Old Gray House up and running. Even though we are a small business it takes money to pay our bills and when we can no longer do so we will be forced to close our doors. One thing you can rest assured is what time we have left with our business we are not going to spend our time discussing what is wrong with the Hatteras and Ocracoke Islands. At the Old Gray House we will be ready and willing to share with you all the wonderful things that are still to be found. It was many years ago that I wrote my first thoughts about the changes occurring on the Islands and submitted it to Irene Nolan who was editor of the Island Breeze at that time. It was because of Irene encouraging me to continue writing that I occasionally take the time to share my thoughts with others. Since that time I have been called a few names, such as an ignorant in-bred islander, even in Irene’s Blog for my comments. I am not thin skinned as a result from exposure to Hatteras sunlight and saltwater. Therefore, I will continue to say what I think regardless of any names called me by others. I hope you will never let anyone intimidate you or stop you from your right to freedom of expression. If you have not done so I would encourage you to express your feelings about the beach issue or any other issue you desire. Do not sit idly on the side-lines and let others speak for you.
To you who have decided to never come back to our beautiful Islands I can only say we will miss you. If you should change your mind we will be waiting with open arms to welcome you back

Dewey Parr - 30-01-’12 20:21
Paul

I am very disappointed with the NCBBA on this. I have been a member for over 30 years and have given quite a bit of money to them especially since this debacle started. I don’t feel that they have done as much as they could do to protect our rights. I doubt I will renew this year. Its time to find another place to vacation in the summer.

Paul - 30-01-’12 20:21
Anon

The NCBBA has had nothing to say about the final rule, but they did right a couple letters to the VA Pilot about some of their writings.

The beach access orgs will loose memberships and not because of the rule, but because of their handling of this stuff.

Mainly their handling of info. They want Irene and others to be responsible for what they are elected to handle.

There has never been a shortage of info from these groups when it came to tournaments, BBQs or bingo games, but they rarely have had anything to say in the past 4 years about what was transpiring, except for the occasional quote in an article.

Anon - 30-01-’12 21:08
anon

So that’s it? Its over? Not one word from OBPA or NCBBA? NPS kicked our ass and now they want us to pay for it. So much for improving the economy. On the bright side, these rules could produce 2-3 extra birds and thats worth killing traditions, cultures, and businesses.
Now that the fisherman won’t be coming anymore and most of the tackle shops will close, what new businesses could you now attract?

anon - 31-01-’12 01:13
Joyce

This is so sad for everyone, but I will be back every year that I am alive. They cannot take away the beauty that I see and the feeling of being home when I come here!

Joyce - 31-01-’12 06:43
Kris Shelton

Prior to the CONsent Decree in 2008 I came down for two weeks each year. After dealing with the ridiculous closures caused by the CONsent Decree the first year in 2008, I cut back to one week. We came for one week in 2009 and 2010 and did not come at all last year. I will come back this year for one week, but I will NOT purchase a driving permit and give the NPS one damned cent of my money. However I will now be searching for Oceanfront/Semi-Oceanfront to make up for the loss of the driving access. I will now have to pay more for my rental so this means less money spent at the local businesses by me. I am sure there are many more thousands just like me out there who will cut back if not now not come at all. It is really sad what the eco-whacko’s and the NPS are doing to the island that so many of us love……

Kris Shelton (Email ) - 31-01-’12 07:32
Pumpkinboy

So the Eco;s sued because ther was no federally approved ORV plan. Now there is a plan, and this plan list several ramps that are not in existence. Why don’t we sue to get an injunction forbidding the park service from implementing this plan, and the permits fees, until these ramps are in place?

By my reasoning, the park service in currently unable to fullfilll the requirements of the current ORV plan, ergo is out of compliance with the ORV plan until all the new ramps are built.

Feel free to discus.

Pumpkinboy - 31-01-’12 08:33
Salvo Jimmy

The linked maps are suspect because they show a seasonal route off the Pole Rd at Hatteras Spit. I see no such route in the route table in the actual final rule. I think the maps are hold overs from the proposed rule.

Salvo Jimmy (Email ) - 31-01-’12 08:44
Native Son

NPS can’t fix ramp 44 and ramp 45 with the materials sitting right there,how are they supposed to build new ramps and walk-overs with no funding and no labor force?Watch and see if it gets done.Thats just like they say that exposure to salt spray and rain does’nt damage the metal gallery of the Bodie Island Lighthouse.What a blivet!!!!

Native Son - 31-01-’12 09:10
bbc

ugh.

bbc - 31-01-’12 09:48
anon

I think we need to demand a “town hall” meeting with Mike Murray, Jon Jarvis, and Destry Jarvis to explain to the people what are all these changes. Pushing out some piece paper “rule” from 1000 miles away is not sufficient for the drastic changes they are about implement. I want Jarvis and Mike to look into the eyes of people they are going to affect.

Pumpkinboy, I agree its a good angle but I don’t know jack about lawyers. I thought that was what the OBPA and NCBBA were supposed to do but I don’t see them do anything.

anon - 31-01-’12 09:54
AmyS

Dewey, I really enjoyed reading your thoughts above. I will be coming back to Hatteras this year, as much as I can, and thought it’s been years since I have visited the Old Gray House, I will make it a point to come in a make a purchase this year, and I will bring friends with me that haven’t ever been. It would be heartbreaking to see such a unique and interesting shop close it’s doors. I have a crystal ring holder in my bedroom that I purchased there and use daily. I plan to go to Hatteras as long as it still brings me joy. I truly hope that I can find a way to still enjoy it after all of this. But I won’t give up on it so easily. I need to see what’s what before I make any decisions, and I hope many others will do the same. Hatteras will always have a place in my heart. And, Mr. Parr, I have never seen the sunrise from South Beach, and I may not ever have that chance, but I did enjoy many a sunset there. It was also my favorite place. Perfect for families with children, and pets. I too will mourn the loss of vehicle access to that area. I don’t see myself and my 2 year old being able to make that walk on a hot summer day, sadly. Hatteras, I’ll see you soon.

AmyS - 31-01-’12 10:02
Bob Davis

Thanks for your thoughts Dewey. Many residents and visitors have very deep binds to these beaches. Your admonition to continue to be courteous to Park Service employees speaks well of your Southern Hospitality. It may be propper not to shun these individuals, who are only doing their jobs but I am mindful of the German troops who shut the doors on the cattle cars that headed to Buchenwald or Dachau. They too were just doing their jobs knowing that if they did not obey orders they would be inside the train car themselves. The scheme for beach closure came from Audubon and the SELC lawyers. The orders came from NPS management. These are the real evil in our midst. By the way has anybody figured out how to drive on the landward side of pedestrians when they occupy the toe or side of the dune? Do we sit and block the trail until we can convince them to move toward the ocean ? This is what happens when bureacrats in Colorado, who don’t know our beachlife, make rules !

Bob Davis (Email ) - 31-01-’12 10:05
anon

To all: Mike Murray is the evil one, he was the architect of the plan. He received an award for the creation of the plan. He is solely accountable for this travesty against the American people. He was only influenced by Audubon and SELC, but in the end it was his decision to force this upon the people. Just like he did to Cape Cod. Don’t forget that!

anon - 31-01-’12 10:23
Ginny

Two points. With respect to NCBBA, OBPA, CHAC, etc. and those who say where are they and what are they doing? Well, with the laws written so that every environmental group can get standing and so that every other citizen CANNOT, exactly what would you suggest. At this point, I do believe the above are formulating a strategy and we will learn the details in due time—OBPA has been faithfully issuing a newsletter 2 times each year.

Second point. With respect to not returning to the island or limiting visits, two close friends have recently reformulated their plans. The decisions are not mean spirited or based upon a desire to make a point. The decisions are based solely upon the cost and benefits. Stated more specifically, both friends have annual sites for campers—cost of site rental, camper, maint of camper, etc. Both friends have jobs and visit for several short stays each year which means having to buy an annual permit and hoping they can use it during the busy weekends when they can get here. Both friends have other committments to consider (one revolves around a child entering school age with the need to consider schools, school activity, etc. while the other has a property on the north beaches that needs work and adult children that are struggling). Both have decided that without some reasonable and predictable access their funds and limited time will be better spent in other areas where they have a better chance of enjoying their limited time off.

I don’t have a lot of “close” friends from off island and the rule has not even been implemented yet. So if I know 2 families that have given up, just think what the next few years will bring.

Finally, we should all be calling, screaming, yelling, about the total lack of details. Less than two weeks and we still don’t know the cost of the permit, the type of equimpment we will be required to carry, and will the ramps be manned? Why? What is the big secret? The NPS must know by now. Something smells!@

Ginny (Email ) - 31-01-’12 10:37
Salvo Jimmy

And further on Pumpkinboy’s theme

In the responses to the final rule re implementation prior to new ramps in place, the answer says the vehicle route between ramp 59.5 and ramp 63 is the only one that would not have access without a new ramp. That is not true as access is available thru ramp 63, just like any other dead end formed by a VFA with no new ramps. The temp use of existing ramp 59 just enhances access by providing a 2nd access until 59.5 is built.

A similar situation exists on Bodie Island. The route from new ramp 2.5 down just past ramp 4 at present only has one access, ramp 4.

What is the logic of not temporarily using existing ramp 2 (= 59) on a seasonal basis (as in the past) until ramp 2.5 (= 59.5) is built since ramp 4 (=63) provides the only access.

Now likely NPS would try to indicate the beach in the area of 59 – 63 is many times narrow and thus access would be cut off from 63 going North. But guess what, the same narrow situation exists many times from ramp 2-4.

And further in both cases a VFA would be temporarily encroached on for a 0.5 mile and at ramp 2 only in off season.

The NPS logic is totally and blantantly inconsistent and false in the only access statement.

Salvo Jimmy (Email ) - 31-01-’12 11:00
Anon

Ginny,

The secret details of the OBPA’s and NCBBA’s next move is a moot point. They have lost the trust of a lot of their contributors and anything they do from this point on will be difficult to fund without some new participants.

They loose said trust simply because they do not repsond and a twice a year news letter doesn’t cut it.

It would take 5 minutes for a board member to draft a press release and another 20 minutes for it to be reviewed by several other CHAPA members for approval.

The enviromentalists do a great job of spreading their thoughts rapidly, but our side has been and is unefficent at doing so. This creates discontent among their people.

The internet is a powerfull tool and these organizations have failed for years at utilizing it, although they know it’s importance, even if some of their members deny it.

Thousands of people are looking for info and aresponse online daily and there is none to be found almost 2 weeks later.

You can however find a letter to the editor of the VA Pilot on the front page of the NCBBA’s website. Yeh, that so important right now. Trying to get the Pilot to get their info straight, rather then getting your own info straight with your members.

Good job people. At least you have your priorities straight.

Anon - 31-01-’12 12:42
Anon

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/01/31/ran..

Coming soon to a National Park near you!

Anon - 31-01-’12 14:07
mark carter

A very sad day indeed, But I will still come out to fish and support the local tackel shops and resturants & such, When ever government gets involved with anything more freedoms are lost. I though people came before birds. I guess the constitution does not mean anything any more.. sad….

mark carter (Email ) - 31-01-’12 14:36
Cap'n Obvious

This plan is basically bullet proof, which I bet is why the enviros are putting a positive spin on it despite it not being everything they wanted either (remember Bluewater and NPCA? didn’t they want a complete ban on driving?). This thing’s been through years of process — neg-reg or reg-neg or whatever that was, workbooks, and comments, economic analyses, and a full-blown EIS. NPS dotted every i and t on this one, cause they knew both sides were looking ot sue. Besides, even if a lawsuit could be won, which I gotta doubt given how the critical habitat case turned out, aren’t OBPA and CHAPA still deep in debt from the last rounds?

Dewey Parr wrote a moving and thoughtful post above. He is exactly right. Irene’s "new normal" is right. I’ll keep coming down because there’s still plenty to do here and it’s still a stunning place. Hope others do as well. But as for the rest of this, it is time to move on and accept what cannot be changed.

There are bigger issues now — the bridge, the new inlets and what will bridge them, the shoals and dredging, erosion and sea-level rise. I do fear for the future of the island, but not because of these ORV rules.

Cap'n Obvious - 31-01-’12 15:00
Paul

Dewey Parr wrote:

“I would like to say to those who are spewing out hate for the Audubon Society, Defenders of Wildlife and the Administration and employees of the Cape Hatteras National Recreational Park that there is nothing to gain by doing so.”

True, Mr. Parr. One thing people can do if they haven’t already is to write to the former two groups and explain why you are ceasing to donate to them. (In the case of Audubon, we ended over two decades of support when their support of this ridiculousness became apparent several years ago, and exchanged several letters explaining why.) And, I agree, be nice to the rangers; they’re just doing their job, and many don’t like it, either.

There is one big question no one seems to have answered throughout this situation – or of they have, I haven’t seen it reported: Who benefits from these closures? I’ve never seen or heard a believable response. Surely such a massive limitation, along with its punitive recriminations for alleged violations, has been enacted with more than altruism for a few plovers (or whatever species is being invoked) in mind. (The closures in New England were allegedly to benefit plovers, which, after many years, have yet to stage their “promised” comeback. But I digress….) So the questions remain. Where does the money trail go? Why? Can anything be done once we find out? I wish I had the time, connections, legal and/or financial talent to pursue those questions, but I don’t.

Can we also try to appreciate one more thing, before painting out entire groups with a broad brush? It is not “the” environmentalists that have wrought this mess – it is “some” environmentalists. (This is like saying all Republicans are bad or all Democrats are good – or vice versa. There are many shades of understanding within these large groupings. Some of each group are and are not wrong or right about different things. But I digress again….) Why this particular environmental cadre wishes to declare war on the lifestyle of the islands is beyond my understanding. (The more cynical among us might think that they resent something that works which they don’t comprehend, and thus feel a need to control it.) My wife and I are environmentalists, but we are the kind who understand the balance between humankind, animals and the land and sea, and seek to maintain it, rather than going to extremes, as this ruling does. Cape Hatteras is what it now is, not what it might have been in some mythical (and difficult) past. A workable coexistence between humanity and nature had been established by residents and visitors, and this wrong-headed ruling has disrupted that balance.

As longtime summer visitors and more recent property owners (in Hatteras and Frisco), we regret these overwrought regulations. This particular battle may be over, but the discontent that has motivated us to fight it is far from resolved. Let’s keep our eyes open for new opportunities – and in the meanwhile, let’s enjoy this unique and wonderful place to the best of our abilities. Isn’t that why we all care so passionately?

Paul

Paul - 31-01-’12 15:39
Bob

I agree 100% with the comments about OBPA and NCBBA. Joined both organizations back in the late 90’s. I got a small plate and 1 newsletter from OBPA and a license plate from NCBBA and that was it….not even a request to renew either one, so I didn’t! With no proof of action from these entities, they will lose A LOT more members very quickly.

Bob - 31-01-’12 15:54
Salvo Jimmy

Any member of NCBBA should read the current (Jan / Feb 2012) newsletter, specifically the President’s Corner. It says what has been going on with them and CHAPA ( NCBBA, OBPA and CHAC, among others are members) since the release of the Final Rule on 20 Jan 2012.

Just received mine today by email

Salvo Jimmy (Email ) - 31-01-’12 16:02
Anna

So if I read the maps right the following ramps are closed or might as well be for the majority of us visitors.

Ramp 23
Ramp 34
North of Ramp 38

This is worse than I expected. So much for fishing nearby if you stay in Avon. Unless you can afford a ocean front behemoth cottage.

Anna (Email ) - 31-01-’12 16:19
Anon

Paul,

You are exactly right. Not all enviromentalist are hardliners.

Just like not all ORVers abuse the beach or drive like maniacs.

SJ,

The problem with newsletters are that they do not address the tons of non-members like myself or those whose address has changed,etc.

There is a reason the USPS and newspapers around the world are struggling to struggeling to survive and that is because the internet has become the main form for transfer of information.

A lot of people that have contributed a great deal of money to this cause are not members and they deserve to be informed a little better.

What is the purpose of these orgs to have websites if they are not properly updated.

The otherside is aware of the power of the internet and of the fact that not all donors are members and capatilize on the net highly.

If the beach proponents plan to continue to fight, then they need to get with the times or step off.

Anon - 31-01-’12 16:42
Rebecca

Can someone clarify for me, even though we can’t drive in all sections, they didn’t close anything to walking (except for nesting closures)? Is that true?

Rebecca - 31-01-’12 16:55
Rock

Don’t worry Hatteras…to quote The Terminator ..“I’ll be back!”…No amount of restrictions can keep me from my paradise.

Rock (Email ) - 31-01-’12 17:54
Salvo Jimmy

Anon re newsletters.

I received the NCBBA newsletter by email, not snail mail.

The “otherside” is run by paid professionals and has deep pockets from nationwide support.

The pro access orgs are run by a few volunteers, who in general have “another” job to support themselves. Money donated generally goes into a legal fund. And the amounts pale in comparison to the “otherside”.

It would be great if they had the resources (manpower and $s) to keep websites updated as the “otherside” does but they don’t.

Rebecca,

True but add turtles to closures

Salvo Jimmy (Email ) - 31-01-’12 18:00
Salvo Jimmy

Link to NCBA newsletter

http://www.ncbbaonline.com/docs/ncbbanew..

Salvo Jimmy (Email ) - 31-01-’12 18:02
Anon

I revert back to my earlier post. If the issue involves, donations, tournaments or fund raisers, then the orgs have info on a bunch of sites.

Why are they so busy that they can’t do the same for other issues?

Makes no sense and is unacceptable.

I’ve seen the board members of NCBBA posting multiple times a week, when it comes to the Drum tournament.

Anon - 31-01-’12 19:57
Jen

I have a question about the report that the ORV beaches will have Occupancy limits at all times. How does the NPS expect to monitor the number of people coming on and off at each ramp? The only way I can see this being accomplished is with a person stationed at each ramp or an elaborate computer tracking/gate system, both of which would cost a ton of money. Sounds like the cost of the permits would need to go to cover that alone.Am I missing something here?

Jen - 31-01-’12 20:44
Barbara Ackley

I am a life member of all these groups. I support them as best I can. Please remember, even though you are rightfully impatient, these folks are not employed professionals. John Couch has a business to run. Anne Bowers, who writes the Newsletter, has a business to run, Natalie Kavenah is a working mother in a family business. All have lost business due to closures. Several of the other OBPA board members have had major health problems from access work (heart attacks, serious anxiety attacks, etc.) Larry Hardham has had to take a leave of absence from all OBPA work due to the harm NPS work has done to his health. Wheat and Anne have had to stop doing some of the work they had been doing. Last year they found that they had to stop handling the calendar awards. David Scarborou had to take that, Larry’s treasurers job, and various writing assignments over and suffered severe burnout last summer. Wayne Mathus and Ron Tasso have been on vacation and away for over a month. Most are older, many are grandparents.

Do you know what Cindy Holda told John Couch not too long ago? Why doesn’t he start a beach shuttle to the Point to make some money?!!! Some time ago she told Bob Eakes (not a board member) that he was young enough to start another business! This is what these folks are faced with. Please don’t come to this site to bury them but to praise them! (Shakespeare, please excuse me)

Barbara Ackley - 31-01-’12 20:50
Salvo Jimmy

Right on Barbara. You filled in the blanks on paid professionals vs volunteers.

Anon,

Why don’t you just discuss your concerns with some of the board members. Unlikely they will see your or others concerns here as they don’t have time to monitor forums such as this. Email contacts for NCBBA and OBPA are available on their web sites.

Salvo Jimmy (Email ) - 01-02-’12 08:48
Salvo Jimmy

Related to access, particularly Pea Island

NC 12 decisions delayed

http://outerbanksvoice.com/2012/01/31/n-..

Note some folks apparently refer to the inlet as Ranger Station Inlet now.

Salvo Jimmy (Email ) - 01-02-’12 08:52
Anon

Barbara,

You make my point easier and easier. A good business person knows that communication is key to success.

Between the 3 major players of CHAP there is at least 15 boards members and I find it hard to believe that not ONE of them could have stroked a 1 paragraph response, within the 1st 72 hours.

CHAPA needs to be run as a business and as most successful non-profits have found out, it’s neccesary to have a combination of volunteers and paid employees who have specific tasks.

Instead of throwing every penny of their money at lawyers, maybe they should’ve hired a public relations rep to help with their image and exposure.

A few years ago at the anglers club tournament I commented on liking that year’s t-shirt to a board member. The board member was more then happy to tell me how excited they were that I like the shirt because much thought had been put into it and they spent 5 hours deliberating the color.

WOW. If that’s the case when it comes to choosing a shirt color then the rest of the most basic access decisions will take decades.

I inquired why ther was a one year gap in the production of the fund raising calendar and was told it was due to the lack of volunteers and the lack of time the few volunteers did have.

I then asked if the calendar made good money and the response was, yes. If this is the case then it would prove to be beneficial for CHAPA to hire a fund raiser on a commision based salary.

They would make far more money paying someone to make them money, then to have gaps, because they are trying to raise money without overhead. Most non-profits do this.

If they are unable to spend time updating their site, then they need to pay someone to do this. It takes money to make money.

A quality, regularly updated site will increase knowledge, income and overall support. Time and time again members and supporters have complained about the lack of updates and info on their sites.

We get more frequent info from the otherside, then we do our own. No wonder they are winning.

If CHAPA’s business plan is to continue to have fishing tournaments, small fund raisers, annual fishing accomplishment awards and bingo games, then continue on.

If CHAPA plans on fighting the full time, paid opposition you speak of, then then better come up with a new plan, becasue they are not even close to giving threat to those people.

No one argues that these board members haven’t worked hard or dedicated their lives to this fight.

While few are posting to this, there are hundreds, upon hundreds that feel this way. These people equate to money and support.

A new business plan will make a major difference in confidence.

Or, they can just do what most are expecting and make annoucement about sueing. We need your help and support and now is the time to fight.

How about they start a new fight ,on a new level, before making such requests, because the old and current systems have accomplished nothing.

Get better organized. Get better prepared. Get a better plan, then organize and inform your people.

Anon - 01-02-’12 09:13
Ginny

Rebecca—yes you can walk at the VFA but the parking at the ramps is limited and the VFA at 27 and 34 have typically been closed early to all!

The ramps left (ramp 30 steep drop off and soft sand and ramp 38 nortoriously difficult) are the most difficult beaches to navigate and you will not be able to access them from other ramps as in the past. Is this by design?

Again, and especially for those so quick to criticize volunteers, where is the outrage that we don’t have the details yet? You can’t tell me NPS doesn’t have a plan with only 2 weeks to implementation. You should be ringing their phone off the hook.

Why the secrecy?

Ginny (Email ) - 01-02-’12 09:20
Scott in EI

The saddest thing about how the dark-side won this battle is that they did so without facts and data. The fact that they were able to use “logic” that would not stand up to a 3rd grader’s common sense to make such a sweeping change can only be explained by politics and greed. I’d bet my right arm that not a single plover or turtle is saved by this enormous economic investment, but that’s an unsubstantiated and under-funded argument that has not held up in court.

I believe the key to winning this war is with FACTS. I think these must be broadly divided between economic and environmental lines. One could chart the actual impact to-date (factoring in broader economic factors) and projected (also conservatively factoring a broader recovery). Then there are the environmental ones. Is there an objective third party that could baseline and chart the impact on turtles and plovers? I would fully expect an outcome of “We spent $X to save -N turtles and -Y plovers”. Nice ROI. Now give us our property and livelihoods back and btw you owe us $X in well documented damages. If there is any money left over after that you can invest that in a dedicated birds and turtles breeding facility in Colorado.

Basically, we need objective bird counters and bean counters to baseline and track facts. This gives our legal and political structure something real to fight with. The dark side will be left with the same ineffective weapons that we have been using.

That would be a cause I’d be willing to invest in.

Look forward to spending my annual week there in October. I’ll be swallowing my pride when I step up to the world’s largest vending machine to double-pay for a resource that is already mine.

Scott in EI - 01-02-’12 09:39
Anon

Ginny,

Email from the NPS on the details of the permit went out a while ago. $120.00 annually and $50.00 per week.

Anon - 01-02-’12 09:46
Bob

Anon,

AMEN, couldn’t have said it better myself. I don’t think anyone is disputing the hard work the volunteers put into those organizations (OBPA, NCBBA, CHAPA, etc.), but the current plan of attack is not working and needs to be revisited. At the very least just let your members know what is going on with frequent updates (something other than send us your money so we can fight this).

Bob - 01-02-’12 10:08
dap

My family is one of those that Ginny mentioned earlier that have decided not to return for a variety of reasons. While mostly economic and family-oriented on our part, everyone needs to realize this also:

We are not alone by a long shot.

I personally know of 5-6 family units that will no longer be coming to HI on a regular basis, mainly due to the now known costs of the permitting system coupled with the unknowns related to beach accessibility due to closures, etc. That’s upward of 25-30 people that will no longer be spending time OR money on these islands, but you can rest assured they will be spending both somewhere else, as recent posts here have shown.

Imagine just how many others are making similar plans for their future family vacations for these and other reasons.

After nearly 20 years of spending 30-45 days and literally thousands of dollars per year on-island, we will spend only 3 days there in 2012, (only to remove our belongings), and will likely spend ZERO of either time or money in the years to come after this. I never thought I’d be saying this, but CAROVA to the North and NC’s Crystal Coast to the South are starting to look better all the time.

While I will continue to be a paying member of CHAC, NCBBA and OBPA, I simply refuse to pay one single penny to become a member of the NPS’ new beach club a la Assateague, particularly for a beach where I am already part owner and a known good steward. While the permit fee and new VFA’s would have been a bitter pill to swallow had we decided to stay, it was far from the deal breaker for my family.

Irene and her aftermath would prove to be just that.

The final straw(s) came firstly in the guise of the utter disregard for public safety exhibited by the USFWS, NPS and SELC Group with regards to the Bonner Bridge Replacement and maintaining Rt. 12 in general.Secondly, after Irene’s devastation it is plainly evident that the PINWR end of HI is going to be allowed to purposefully overwash regardless of what the State of NC, NCDOT, or anyone else has to say about the road, at least for the short term. Inlets will not be filled, dunes will not be rebuilt, it is only a matter of time before there will simply be no road on that end of the island, which will satisfy the sensibilities of some completely.

Maybe a rabbit can be pulled out of somewhere as was done with the Isabel Inlet situation, but given the track record of late, I seriously doubt it will happen. Sadly, it will likely take a substantial loss of human life due to these clearly unsafe conditions before anything regarding public safety is committed to concerning Rt. 12.

Enough griping. Now for the hard part:

Irene, thank you for being the sole beacon of truthful news regarding these issues, for without your peerless paper and blog, the access side of this equation would have had nowhere to turn for breaking news that we so desperately needed during these trying times. May you keep bringing journalistic integrity to the Outer Banks and well beyond for decades to come!

For everyone else, we wish nothing but the best for all the islands residents, business owners, visitors and lovers of all things Hatteras, and will never forget the good times, friendships and beauty that Hatteras and Ocracoke Islands have brought into our lives. May the long-term future bring all of you better times that the last few years have.

For the short term, however, we must bid all a fond yet deeply saddened farewell.

May God Bless and Keep You All,

dap and Family
Elsewhere, USA.

dap - 01-02-’12 12:42
Kris Shelton

Fantastically well spoken Dap! The best to you and your family. I fear my week in late August will be our last as well. As I already stated above yesterday, I too will not give the NPS one cent of my money.

Kris Shelton (Email ) - 01-02-’12 13:18
dude

Dap, you will not be missed. Another tourist will take your place, and will spend just as much money, just not in bait and tackle shops

dude - 01-02-’12 13:20
Irene

ORV permits will cost $120 a year and go on sale Feb. 15

The new off-road vehicle permits for the Cape Hatteras National Seashore will cost $120 a year or $50 a week and will go on sale on Wednesday, Feb. 15. The permits are required by the final rule for ORV use at the seashore, which was released to the public on Jan. 20 and becomes effective Feb. 15.

The Park Service says there will be transition period between Feb.15 and March 15 before the rule is fully implemented and enforced. This will allow time for the seashore to install new ORV route markers and informational signs and for people to obtain the permit.

Irene - 01-02-’12 13:48
dap

Dap, you will not be missed. Another tourist will take your place, and will spend just as much money, just not in bait and tackle shops.

Dude,

Thank you for your warm and heartfelt sentiments! Perhaps one day Karma will set you to rights by taking something away that you dearly love.

For the record, Surfing and SCUBA Diving brought me to HI, and I did all of my fishing at Risky Business using a $20 bill for bait. I can and will do all three elsewhere, rest assured.

People with condescending attitudes like yours will surely not be missed on my end.

To the well-intentioned folks like Kris above, I too wish you and yours the best.

dap - 01-02-’12 14:29
dude

so it’s better to cut of your nose to spite your face, and have no beach instead of some, meanwhile throwing the business owners under the bus because you can not adapt.

Boo hoo for you

dude - 01-02-’12 14:48
Salvo Jimmy

Dude,

Keep in mind over the last 2-3 yrs many of the VFA areas have been closed to all, eg Ramps 23 and 34, and areas at or near Ramps 27 and 30 to name some. I submit it won’t take long for your replacement tourist, looking for that “Vehicle Free Experience” to find themselves facing either a beach crowded by vehicles or alternatively a “No Beach Experience” Then they will cut off their noses and go away as well.

For all,

Take the new maps with a grain of salt. I’ve found one error already and stopped looking. Besides they are almost useless because of the size, resulting in lack of detail. And I’m sure a lot of $s have been wasted printing them up to pass out to permit applicants.

Salvo Jimmy (Email ) - 01-02-’12 15:20
Crotalus

Dude,
Look on the bright side, the OBX is going to be a much better place when all these ‘fair weather" fisherman cease visiting.

SJ,
According to the annual report maps, it’s been a couple of years since 34 was closed. Perhaps they envision those birds coming back, but I see no reason for having a VFA right next to a village.

Crotalus - 01-02-’12 15:30
dude

Hey Crotalus Ever stop to think that your opinion about fewer visitors to a National Park being a good thing may have had something to do with you getting booted off the island by your employer
?

dude - 01-02-’12 16:08
dap

Dude,

Funny, I thought we were on the same side of this issue form your past posts, but I guess I was mistaken. Seems I’m the enemy now that I have made one of the hardest choices that I ever had to make in my life.

so it’s better to cut of your nose to spite your face,….

Please re-read my original post carefully, since you apparently could not understand that my reasons for not coming back are economic, (IE: trying to sell a house in a down market to then buy another, all to get my child in a better school district, which means having to make some tough sacrifices), rather than being based on the NPS rules alone.

…and have no beach instead of some,…

Again, you seem unable to comprehend that I will see plenty of beach, in due time, in numerous places other than HI. This is but a temporary setback.

…meanwhile throwing the business owners under the bus….

That I simply cannot help, as much as I wish I could, for reasons listed above. Talk to Mr. Mike Murray & Co. about the rest.

…. because you can not adapt.

Here you are almost correct, but only about 1/2 way. There are three basic choices in life that apply to any given situation, and they are: Adapt, Migrate, or Die. This time around, I was forced to go with Migrate, and I sincerely hope that you never have to make the same kind of hard choice yourself, because it truly sucked.

Boo hoo for you

Once your anger has eased somewhat, I hope that you will realize you have purposely kicked a dedicated pro-access man while he was very down.

dap - 01-02-’12 16:32
Crotalus

Dude,
I’ve not been booted anywhere, by anybody. Thanks for your concern.

And I wasn’t talking about the quantity of visitors, but the quality of visitors. The numbers aren’t going to change.

Crotalus - 01-02-’12 16:37
Salvo Jimmy

Yes Crot on 34. Why I said 2-3 yrs.

For all.

Just stumbled on another map error that is in direct conflict with the words in the rule route table.

I had pointed out the first error ( an ommision) to NPS. The 2nd one I gave to NPS as an exercise for the map author to find.

But of course I’m sure the maps will stand on the basis of “BEST AVAILABLE

Salvo Jimmy (Email ) - 01-02-’12 16:49
Crotalus

SJ,
Sorry, since Ramp 34 was preceded by “over the last 2-3 yrs many of the VFA areas have been closed to all” it appeared to me that you meant 34 had been closed for the past 2 or 3 years, not just 3 years ago and open the last two.

Crotalus - 01-02-’12 16:55
Salvo Jimmy

Crot

It depends on the meaning of ……

heh heh heh

Salvo Jimmy (Email ) - 01-02-’12 17:25
Anon

Dap,

Please stop wasting our time with your lame excuses. Another who goes on and on with best wishes to the businesses of the Outer Banks while bailing out. Enjoy your vacation wherever it may be and leave us who really care about the Outer Banks alone.

Anon - 01-02-’12 19:29
Anon2

Dap, will you go to Carova instead? If not, then where?

But know you are welcome back here anytime. Seriously.

Anon2 - 01-02-’12 19:59
Dewey Parr

Now we know … $120.00 annually and $50.00 weekly to drive the beach. There are still many things we do not know. Will there be lower rates for senior citizens. Will there be exceptions for special interest groups not only in the rates but in privileges on the beach. How will the new rules and regulations apply to surf fishing tournaments such as the Anglers Club, Frank and Fran, Hatteras Village Civic Association and a host of others? Will they be granted a discount for their participants and will they be allotted space on the beach to conduct their activities. If they are granted extra space will that mean others will be barred from the beach during that time due to the occupancy limits being set for each section of the beach. Will exceptions be made for commercial fishermen who require extra space on the beach to haul in their nets? Will there be an extra charge for towing a boat or will you even be allowed to launch a boat off the beach? I wonder if anyone has really taken time to consider what the devastation this will be too many business on the Islands. Should close by weekenders out of Virginia and North Carolina no longer elect to come it will mean a tremendous loss to Motels, Restaurants, and Small family owned Grocery Stores. For those many residents on the Islands who are happy about these changes for they feel now they have their own little private beach they need to take the time to consider what these changes will lead to in the future. With less money coming into Hyde and Dare Counties they can look forward to cuts in services and higher property rates as well as a decline in property values when it comes to re-sale. As I see it everybody looses in the long run. Why? Because, the Audubon Society, Defenders of Wildlife and the Cape Hatteras National Recreational Park does not care about the welfare of the general public.

Dewey Parr - 02-02-’12 05:37
Crotalus

Dewey,
The tournaments are "grandfathered" in. If a tournament has been held in a VFA in the past, it will be allowed in the future. Barring sea turtle nests or other resource closures, of course.

Crotalus - 02-02-’12 06:12
Rob Alderman

Dewey,
From what I read boat utility trailers are allowed on the beach, but cannot exceed tandem axle and there was no mention of a special or additional fee for towing/usage.

I doubt there will be any group discount and no offense, there shouldn’t be. A tournament participants money is worth no more or less then other ORV users, so they should not be given discount. If the NPS was to grant such a thing there would be more outcry from non-particpants.

I see where some of the very large tournaments may have issue with the carrying capacity. There will be no way to ensure beach access for all participants if it’s a large tournament and it coincides with a good run of fish.

Again, the NPS cannot grant them much more special attention then the use of a VFA, without getting fried by the paying public. I am sure it’ll remain 1st come,1st served on the access of a fishing spot.

Rob Alderman - 02-02-’12 06:42
Scott in EI

The Raleigh N&O finally published a story on this in today’s paper. Good to see anything about it in the paper but very unfortunate that it is titled “Anglers to pay to drive on beaches.” A shame that the Raleigh and Charlotte media have boiled this situation down to this. I sent the author a note and suggested an investigative piece on this and sent him this link – search for facts, please…

Scott in EI - 02-02-’12 08:23
Dewey Parr

Now that the Cape Hatteras National Recreational Park will be enjoying the money they collect from $120.00 and $50.00 paid permits, will there be a change in their Volunteer Program. Will they now have paid personnel at the Lighthouse, bookstore and other areas? Will people continue to volunteer while the Superintendent counts the money and park rangers sit in their offices and play computer games?

Dewey Parr - 02-02-’12 08:35
bbc

very good questions dewey

bbc - 02-02-’12 09:03
Crotalus

Monies from the permit, go to implementing, staffing and managing the permit system/rule. IOWs, there won’t be monies left over.

Crotalus - 02-02-’12 09:14
r doswell

Per NPS on the annual permit…..$120 annual fee is JAN to JAN. If you purchase on Feb. 15 or later it will NOT be prorated for this year. All annual permits purchased in 2012 will expire Dec 31, 2012. Another way we’re getting nothing for $‘s spent.

r doswell - 02-02-’12 09:48
Marty

January to January for year permit no matter when you buy it?? That is some serious horse manure! If you buy a yearly permit for the Shenandoah National Park it expires ONE YEAR from when you buy it. If you buy it in June 2012 it expires in June 2013. So why is the policy different for CHNS?

Also, Crot, when you say there won’t be less visitors, just better quality, what do you mean by that? That those of us who drive on the beach to fish are undesireables or low class individuals or something? That’s a rather judgmental and sweeping generalization and as Mark Twain observed, no generalization is worth a damn, including this one. So who are these high class individuals that are going to take up the slack? Are they all going to fit on the beaches in front of the cottages in the villages? I often meet yuppie types on the Point gathering shells and looking at birds. (I don’t mean yuppie perjoratively, it’s their park too). Aren’t they gonna be pissed when they want to drive out there or even walk out there and find they can’t because of resource closures?

The other problem is that we usually come for a week in the summer. Jobs and funds permitting, we may or may not return in the fall. If we come in August and buy a one week permit for $50 and then come back in October and buy another one for $50, that’s only $20 less than the year permit. Then if we come at Thanksgiving, we would spend more than the yearly permit. And if we can’t get down there to buy the permit until August, we’d pay for a whole year and only get 5 months as it would run out in December. I don’t understand this calendar year thing, that’s the most ridiculous part of this. I wouldn’t mind so much if it was year from the date of purchase like the one we buy for the Shenandoah National Park. (And that’s only $30!). All this money, all this hassle, all this killing of wildlife, all this economic hardship for what? 8 or 10 more birds!! On any standard of cost-benefit analysis, this is a really really bad deal.

Marty (Email ) - 02-02-’12 11:00
Crotalus

Marty,
No, I mean with friends like those, who needs Audubon, DOW or SELC…..

Crotalus - 02-02-’12 11:02
Crotalus

addendum for Marty,
If there were thousands of birds, rather than “8 or 10” we wouldn’t behaving this conversation, or even need to.

Crotalus - 02-02-’12 11:04
Pumpkinboy

If the eco wackos would have set up an reasonable closure size, not submarined Reg Neg, and worked in good faith with the community we would not be having this conversation.

Pumpkinboy - 02-02-’12 11:17
Crotalus

Pumpkin,
The “eco wackos” didn’t set it up. Scientists who actually study the birds did.

Crotalus (Email ) - 02-02-’12 11:36
Linda`

Hoping they have a senior discount!!!
We are not coming until May, so will have to pay the full amount for 6 months???
Guess we will be shuttling family when they come.
Also curious about handicap folks, I have a special plate on my car, so being able to drive on the beach is a big plus as walking is challenging.’
Need more answers, think lots of VA folks will not come down now for the weekend, our loss in the villages. This summer will tell the tale.

Linda` - 02-02-’12 11:46
Pumpkinboy

Horsepucky, the plover recovery plan states the enclosure shall be 200 to 1000 m. For years and years the NPS biologist worked with the park , submitted a plan to USFW that never once had a 1000 m closure, and the birds did just fine. The 1000 was put in place as part of the consent decree, which was a result of the eco wacko’s lawsuit, and has no justification in any science. The only reason this distance was chosen was it was the maximum allowed under the plover recovery plan. There are no scientific studies that show 1000 m is any more conductive to fledge rates or nest success than 600 m.

400 or even 600 meters allowed access to the point, where as you well know, plover chicks do not nor never have foraged. The 1000, rule is simply there to limit access.

Pumpkinboy - 02-02-’12 11:54
Joe

Irene,

First of all, I enjoy reading your blogs here on the IFP. The articles and reader posts are, for the most part, interesting; and I think your blogs provide a much needed forum for those who want to express opinions and, sometimes, just vent. For that I am grateful.

And since it is you blog, you are entitled to run it any way you desire.

But, if I may offer a suggestion, I think, in the future, you should require readers who want to post on your blogs to REGISTER with their REAL NAME and a VALID and VERIFIABLE E-MAIL ADDRESS which would be included in each of their posts. Also, record a database of IP addresses for those who register to crosscheck and lessen the chance of one person registering under multiple names and e-mail addresses.

The reason I propose this is that, time and time again, I see people post here under a real name, that are then broadsided and lambasted by several posters whose identities are unknown and who, could in fact, be the same person, multi-aliased, and trying to create a false bandstand consensus.

And when I see different aliased posters patting each other on the back and congratulating each other on their collective wisdom, there is no way of knowing if these posters are not in fact, the SAME poster.

Also, while opinions from anonymous posters are fine with me, ‘factual’ posts by anonymous posters are problematic. No name. No credentials, No e-mail address. And often no hyper-links to back up their claims. This just creates the perfect setting to spin the truth and try to pass off anything and everything as authoritative ‘fact’.

And as I rarely post but often read a post I would like to disagree or agree with, how about a simple and visible thumbs up and thumbs down rating for each post; available , once again, to REGISTERED posters only.

Some quick polls would be a nice touch too. Such as: Do you think the fees are 1. Excessive. 2. A Bargain 3. About Right, etc.- once again tracking IP numbers to help ensure one vote per person.
Anyway, just some suggestions I think would help make your blog reader’s posts more useful and probably better mannered too. I will be among the first to sign up if implemented.

Thanks for listening and keep up the fine work.

Joe - 02-02-’12 12:42
anon

"What I fear is, more ATV use by teenagers, who hear the outrage by their parents, for example, and will take matters into their own hands, thinking, if they get rid of the nests, their parents can drive on the beach again."

Wolf Bass, have you ever been to Cape Hatteras? There has never been ATV’s allowed in the park. The only nests that have been run over were by NPS employees, they drive in sensitive areas, well because they claim they are "protecting the resource", ooops.

Joe (anonymous), if you want to know the truth, look it up yourself. What hypocrite!

anon - 02-02-’12 13:10
Joe

“Joe (anonymous), if you want to know the truth, look it up yourself. What hypocrite!”

Well, there is always Idiolect to fall back on, look that up…

Joe - 02-02-’12 13:14
Wolf Bass

I know it is Illegal. I did not say that it was legal. My point was Exactly that it is Illegal. & Thank You for making sure all know that it is Illegal, BUT, never the less, ATV use was Used-Illegally, and for the Sole Purpose to Vandalize a Nest. In fact it was a certain number of eggs reported to have been destroyed. This was during the last ‘round’ of Defender’s winning, there was a report of an ATV use, of deliberatly running over a turtle nest, also someone shot a mama loggerhead, & i did not say the exact locatioin of these incidents. But naturally ON the Islands. I am sorry I do not have a link, for YOU to look it up, due to it being in the Coastland Times, BUt I might can see if there is an archive of these incidents in another paper. I certianly recall reading them & seeing it in the news.
As I live on OBX. It was before the incident of someone running into a Corrolla Mustang, which they had to put down. so i would say, it was approx 2 yrs ago.
I am not a hypocrite. no need to call me names. you can ask me a question, before assuming.

Wolf Bass - 02-02-’12 13:36
Crotalus

Horsepucky indeed.

The recovery plan calls for a 50 m nest buffer (Assateague uses 200m) and 300m pedestrian chick buffer and a 1,000 m ORV chick buffer.
It does allow for private (non-federal) property owners to use a 200m ORV buffer to reduce Section 6 “takings” ie the government deprives that private property owner use of the property through regulation. With a state wildlife dept and USFWS sign off and constant monitoring.

Crotalus (Email ) - 02-02-’12 13:49
Marty

Out of curiosity, I went and looked at the Assateague Island National Seashore page. Viewed the OSV reg. brochure. They sell their permits for a year from the DATE OF PURCHASE! Why not at CHNS? Also, they have a variety of different pricings depending on whether you want Maryland access only, Va. access only, both states, day only, or day and night, seems more night time access allowed and campers allowed off road even overnight, as long as they have a waste tank that can hold 2 days worth. Permits are priced more competitively too. You can fish there all night over night but NO SLEEPING! (I wonder how they know). So like what’s up with this calendar year crap at CHNS? It also seems that at Assateague you are not required to watch a video, just read the brochure. ??????

Marty (Email ) - 02-02-’12 15:50
samsdad1

Crot… Does this mean on Assateague you can walk to within 300 Meters of the nest site starting at the signs that stop the orv’s? Do they have signs at the 300 meter barrier?

That kind of reminds me of them stating that the “ORV” beaches are open year round… Except when closed for birds and turtles… essentially allowing all beaches to be closed to humans if nest are strategically placed along the seashore.

samsdad1 (Email ) - 02-02-’12 15:58
Keith

“They sell their permits for a year from the DATE OF PURCHASE! Why not at CHNS?”

Good question. In fact, it was raised during the comment period. I haven’t seen a response to that one (or several others) though.

Keith (Email ) (URL) - 02-02-’12 16:27
Buxton Sailor

One thing that all of us should remember is that this is being shoved down our throats by a federal government far more friendly to the minority opinions of SELC, DOW, and Audobon, than to local or even national cares, whether or not they are in the majority.
We should all vote and strive to install a government which is inclined to a more local-up than Washington down approach to governance. Things like this happen because we fail to pay attention! When the government gives you anything, they want something in exchange- your freedom! PAY ATTENTION!!!! VOTE!!!

Buxton Sailor - 02-02-’12 16:41
Salvo Jimmy

I was one who commented on annual vs calendar year permits, noting other units in the NPS system issue annual p[ermits running for a year from date of issue. The answer is in the Fed Reg where the rule was published, #45 in the Summary of Comment section.

Basically says : We decided calendar year was best.

Basically says

Salvo Jimmy (Email ) - 02-02-’12 18:33
AMD

I am so relieved they have restricted vehicles on the beach. I have seen children in danger of being hit by someone speeding down the beach who could be using the road, which is one block away. Most places are accessible by walking a bit from a parking place, and unfortunately, the increased traffic on the beach has ruined it for everyone. It’s not all tourists, often I see locals park their trucks, toss beer cans and blast music. I’m so happy we are not going to turn into Hatteras.

AMD - 02-02-’12 18:54
Lauren

"I’m so happy we are not going to turn into Hatteras."

Really? And just where are you staying? I do not agree with music blasting while you are driving on the beach nor if you are just parked. People come this far south to get peace of mind. Go north of the bridge if you want that crap. Driving on the beach is a way of life around here. You take that away, you take EVERYTHING away. How often have you vacationed down here? Do you honestly know what is was & what it is now? I am a local & I also smoke. I WOULD NEVER THROW MY CIGARETTE BUTTS ON THE BEACH! I pick up others trash when I am out there. You go ahead and blame locals. Just wait for the response you get. I see plenty of tourist just let their trash blow away in the wind. "Oh, no big deal. Someone else MIGHT get it…" I do not blame tourists 100% but I sure blame them for more than 50%. Why would they care about this place? They just come here to vacation. They don’t have to worry about anything else until they leave in a week and go back to their version of "reality". Well, this is ours and it sucks right now and ya’ll doing things like that, ARE NOT helping the matter any. I do not wish for people to stop coming to Hatteras Island, I just wish they would care just a little bit more for the people who have to live here year around.

Lauren (Email ) - 02-02-’12 19:45
my2cents

Are we really complaining about money and calanders. i disagree with having to pay but the real problem is that we are now having to pay and have less access. i will pay 120 bucks but give me my access. ramp 27 to 30 is closed for good(one of the best places to surffish near avon), ramp 34 is closed seasonaly(why can’t we access this, the birds are usually north of ramp 34), the hook/cove closed forever(great place for kids and sometimes a very special spot for surfers, windsurfers and kiteboarders), and finally access to the fire tower denied for eternity(another special place to have family, fish and surf). here are some of my questions: when will the so called new ramps be built and why would you close ramps just to make new ones. if we want to park on the pole roads and walk in to pedestrian only beaches will there be a parking lot buit or will parking be denied.
i am not from here but i do live here and this really hurts my heart. i can’t imagine how a “native” must feel to see the years go by and the access to their beaches get less and less. getting back to the talk of money, i wonder how long i will be able to raise a family here. how can someone say that there will be no economic impact. if, for instance you close down trails on a mountain suited for skiers and every year you close more trails, how long does it take for people to stop coming. i guess we are the guinea pigs and we will find out how long it takes for a beach resort without much beach access to close down. i know people will say you still have a lot of access and yes we do, but we really shouldn’t have to say that. its not easy to get here and its not cheap and the more reasons for people to not make that extra step and spend that extra money to get here just makes it harder for us locals to get by. its hard enought to make it here financially in good times. thanks for listening.

my2cents - 02-02-’12 19:54
Crotalus

samsdad1,
Not sure what you mean. On CAHA, one could walk up to the 300 m signs. The 1000 m No ORV signs were between Ramps 34 and 44 and you could walk past them – if those oystercatchers weren’t there.

I also agree with others here that the permit “year” should be either from the purchase date, or pro-rated.

Crotalus - 02-02-’12 19:58
Jim

I will pay for a permit, in a bag of pennies. I suggust everyone else do the same. Let the protest begin!!!!!!!

Jim - 02-02-’12 21:12
Todd D. from MD

I’m shocked at these new rules and regs about beach driving. I’ve been visiting Hatteras/Buxton/Avon for 30+ years, and the “entire” draw to this beautiful area, is that we could drive on the beach in order to Fish, Sun, Play, etc., but the Govt. has now pretty much ruined this time-honored past time, for a lot of out-of-state, and local people.

What I would give to go back 10 years ago, when the tourists and locals livelyhood were more important than, “what could happen” to some wildlife. (Oh, by the way, that wildlife has been dealing with these and many other issues for centuries.) Who are we as a people to change that??

Todd D. from MD (Email ) - 03-02-’12 05:38
Dewey Parr

Irene, I hope in no way you will heed the advice of Joe-02 02 12 -12:42. For my part I like your blog the way it is. I have found over the years that one of the devises used by those that want to dominate others is to silence all opposition to their views. One of the best ways to do this is to make it almost impossible for them to express their views. Another trick, as Joe pointed out, is to attack those who finally get up enough nerve to express themselves. The problem as I see it when this happens it is not the fault of the attackers but the views of the person who wrote them. When a person presents their opinions they should be willing to stand up for what they believe. If a persons views are so flimsy they are not ready to defend them then I feel it is time to rethink their position. As I see it this is what blogging is all about. It is an opportunity for a free and open discussion on any and all topics. It is a place to express our likes as well as our dislikes. The beauty of blogging is that you get to see all sides of an issue. The people I feel sorry for are those that have a mind set on all issues and will refuse to see the other side. What has happened on Hatteras and Ocracoke Islands is a classic example of that. To me people who never change their thinking are dangerous for they have little or no tolerance for others. Someone said, “A wise man changes his mind, but a fool never does”.

It is true there are times that some will get carried away and use any means possible to get their points across by even assuming false identities. Should they engage in assuming double or triple identities to praise themselves that doesn’t bother me either. Poor things they are probably lonely and have nobody except themselves in their lives. I have no problem with those who are frightened to let others know who they are for fear someone might say something bad about them. As you well know I have been called a few names over the years for my view on a variety of subjects. Momma, taught me a long time ago, “Sticks and Stones May Hurt My Bones, But Words Will Never Hurt Me.”

You have bloggers that I don’t agree with and who at times fall prey to intimidating others intentionally or unintentional. In no way would I want you to stop them from being on your blog. I agree profanity should be discouraged but then again in our modern world of words it is hard to determine what is considered profanity. If I used some of the words when I was growing up that spew out of the mouth of the past Presidents of the United States my mother would have washed my mouth out with her home made lye soap.

There are many who want to conquer and control the world. They are doing everything in their power to limit the public from expressing themselves on the Internet. To accomplish their goals they feel they must silence the public. I hope that you don’t join in with them by limiting who or how one will be allowed to express their views on your blog.

By the way Joe what is your last name?

Dewey Parr - 03-02-’12 06:35
anon

Is there any response from local government? Is there any response from governor? Do they care at all or is this what they wanted? Its clearly stated in the FEIS that this will have a negative effect on the economy, why wouldn’t they care about that? This has the potential of creating a ghost town out of Hatteras Island until, whats left of, the locals figure something else out.

anon - 03-02-’12 07:12
Joe

Dewey,

I agree with your sentiments on not wanting to silence the opinions of anyone, and anonymous speech can sometimes an important. But many blogs at least require that unique aliases be assigned. Look how many using ‘anon’ post here. Are they different people or am I to assume they are the same person? How can I tell who is who is who in posting a rebuttal, or if only one person or maybe more disagrees with my opinion? At any rate, its Irene’s blog and she can do whatever she wants. At this point, with all the petty bickering among the Islanders themselves-“a house divided on itself cannot stand’- and little help from elective representatives, I have pretty much given up hope of ever righting things beach access wise, so I see little reason to offer suggestions or post here anyway except to vent. Good luck to all with the future. Over and out.

PS- My last name ? Obviously it is Mudd for even suggesting this.

Joe - 03-02-’12 09:29
Pumpkinboy

Anyone know if the fee can be paid in pennies? I would, of course, count them out individually to the NPS so they know they are receiving proper payment.

Pumpkinboy - 03-02-’12 11:06
Ginny

The last I heard everyone must accept legal tender—pennies are legal tender.

That said, things in this country are changing so fast with many laws being ignored or violated that I wouldn’t be surprised if they refused it.

BTW where you planning on counting them one by one? Would make the people in line quite angry! Can you imagine how many trucks they would need to make the deposit.

Lots of oppurtiunities to show our disapproval within the law.

Ginny (Email ) - 03-02-’12 11:48
Pumpkinboy

I’m sure the angry people behind me would never vent their anger on the NPS staff after I leave. Beside, most people will be angry before I start to count. All that negative energy might make me loose track, and I’d have to start over.

Pumpkinboy - 03-02-’12 11:56
Joyce

If the permit is only good until December 31st and begins February 15th…the permit should be pro-rated for the loss of 1 and one half months.

Joyce (Email ) - 03-02-’12 12:48
Wolf Bass

Todd, said, who are we as people to change that? meaning change FOR wildlife? are you serious? ‘PEOPLE’ and weather Changed WILDLIFE and WE ARE RESPONSIBLE for them. ever read God’s Command. Even CONGRESSOWNS’ This. Except they do a terrible job in Protecting them, not all the time. Thumbs up on protecting the Red Wolves, in a succesful & tourist attraction: Red WOlf Refuge/Alligator Refuge. SO YES, WE ARE to CARE FOR WILDLIFE< even if it is ‘just’ a Turtle, to you. Look up N.E.S.T. see the Hard Work these Locals are doing. They live here & volunteer here & Help with ALL of their Hearts. They & the NPS work together & they help educate in schools. They are amongst us, those who WANT to Help TUrtles & Wildlife. Look at their site, before you blast off. Tell me, they would not be upset, if some angry person did something idiotic & ilegal as destroy a nest. or kill a turtle. We ALL do NOT need that. This paper has reproted on vandalism before, and it does not Look good on any Islander resident or on the whole Islands, for we CLAIM we CARE. as I said above. WE HAVE to ACT out our WORDS, and NOT just make CLAIMS. IF we CARE< then we must realize that after all these decades, of driving, and the weather changing things too, & populations of peoples, and the high number of traffic from tourists, surely HAS made a Difference For Wildlife. People get mad if a Mustang goes thru ‘their’ 2 million dollar homefront, BUT that horse or it’s relatives, have been going thru that area for hundreds of years! IF IT WAS NOT for PEOPLE, they wouldn’t have that problem and on the other hand, IF IT WERE NOT FOR RESPONSIBLE PEOPLE, who created LAWS to Protect them, and People who CARE about them, they Wouldn’t BE Here. WE have these wildlife that are considered ENDANGERED, NOT because of their own doing, but because of PEOPLE.! TIME TO ‘GIVEBACK. I wished for all residents in that location that there was an exemption for you to have to pay. I am sorry that you have to pay. But you utilize the area the most, also. You say you care about wildlife, but turn your heads if you see a nest. Some do, because you’re thinking, is like that above comment, about not wanting to accept Change. They NEED our HELP, and from PEOPLE who hurt them, and ONLY PEOPLE can HELP them. PLEASE…IF YOU SEE ANY TURTLE activity, tracks, nests, turtles, etc…CALL 252-441-8622. and please take just a moment to see them caring for these endangered animals, and also see the JOY in the childrens’ eyes of learning How to CARE for them. Those children don’t need to come home to hear the opposite! http://nestonline.org/

Wolf Bass - 03-02-’12 13:28
LeeC.

Just found this in a Virginia Post. Question. If the beach driving permit is issued for one year on calendar to calendar year basis (Jan 1,2012-Dec 31,2012) why is the price still $120.00? If I purchased a permit on February 15, that is 46 days out of the new year. That translates into $15.18 at the $00.33 a day yearly break down if pro-rated. Shouldn’t the first year be pro-rated from the date of purchase since the plan was not completed by the beginning of the year? I know of no other business in the country that would be allowed to solicit funds this way. If 1000 people got permits February 15, that would be $15,180 and no services rendered. Many folks will not purchase a yearly permit until mid year 2012 or later which makes it even worse…this is getting bad!

LeeC. - 03-02-’12 13:34
Anon

NPS will be laughing all the way to the bank! They have to pay for all those signs that will litter the beaches.

Anon - 03-02-’12 13:53
Justin Johnson

Staying away from OBX and not buying OVR passes is exactly what the “environmentalists” want. They would prefer to just close the Outer Banks and let the birds and turtles have it all. It is a sad commentary on what money does in our country.

Remember the Golden Rule:

He who has the Gold, makes the rules.

Justin Johnson (Email ) - 03-02-’12 14:10
Dewey Parr

Joe Mudd, (Joe-03 02 12 – 09:29) I appreciated your response and comments. In no way did I intend to offend you personally or cause you to refrain from expressing your views. In many ways I agree with you. It is true petty bickering persist from the beginning of the beach driving issue and is still predominant. As I look around Joe that seems to be the American Way anymore in arriving at a consensus. All we have to do is look at our political primaries of selecting a candidate. They bicker, call each other names and in the end some how a few of them get together to fight the big battle. Others go off in another direction or refrain from doing anything. Joe the law doesn’t prevent them from doing so.

In the case of Beach Driving it was different for the law prevented the voice of the people from being heard. It was a useless fight to begin with for those who were the representatives of the people were caught off guard. A major problem was the time factor to make a decision concerning the Consent Decree that was pushed down their throats. It was either you agree or sign off on it or the entire beach will be closed. With the tourist season about to begin they decided it was in the best interest of the Islands to accept the terms being handed them by the Judge. I am not sure what any of us would have done at that time. I can only surmise that my Island ancestors would have refused to sign. Did the leaders of the User Groups and the County Governments who signed the document in agreement with Consent Decree document know at the time from that point on they tied their hands? Did they know the law prevented them from doing anything for they had signed as the representatives of the people to agree to the terms of the Consent Decree?

For three years we who loved these Islands had to sit back and not only watch our traditional way of life being destroyed, but endure one insult after another being hurled at us by the National park System and their chosen buddies. In those three years there was no apparent leaders on the scene only frustrated often unorganized efforts to maintain our heritage of free and open beaches. Consent Decree, the most archaic law ever enacted in the history of our nation is gone now. It was a well devised scheme used to divide the people and to silence their leaders.

Yes people are venting their frustrations, and they have ever right to do so. I personally hope they continue to do so that maybe others will not let the same thing happen to them in the future. I also hope that you will continue to express your feelings, which you so expertly do. You are not alone, Joe, when it comes to giving up hope that Hatteras and will ever be the same. From here on out as I look in my crystal ball I see even additional regulations coming in the near future that will eradicate any semblances of the Hatteras I once knew and loved. I am guessing you signed off Joe Mudd, because you felt that would be the attitude toward you. I totally disagree with you for it should be, Joe Sand. You definitely have a feeling for the people who live on these Islands and know the joys of having Hatteras sand and salt water between your toes. Dewey Parr (Email ) - 03-02-’12 16:05
JAG VA

I feel as we have had a death in the family. I too am like others who won’t be back after spending 2 weeks each year. The main reason other than access/freedom is the finacial burden. $50.00 plus 3 fishing license=$80.00 before the first cast for my family of 4 with one income. I also wish the local business the best but what can we do when the cost makes the vacation out of reach? Fishing IS everything and my mother and father sure can’t make the walk. All the ugly’s, icecream, T-shirts, and crabs were a result of a FISHING trip with an ORV.

JAG VA - 03-02-’12 22:12
Truth

I can only only hope and pray that the real truth will prevail one day. This criminal NPS plan is just more freedoms taken away from America.

Truth - 04-02-’12 07:25
Ginny

From Wolf:

“I wished for all residents in that location that there was an exemption for you to have to pay. I am sorry that you have to pay. But you utilize the area the most, also.”

Yeah and we supply all the services including fire, water rescue, infrastructure that is well beyond what is required for 4,000 residents. Then there is the wear and tear 2 million visitors create. The park service does not contribute one thin dime to these services. The residents and non resident property owners, including those who do not benefit from tourism because they are retired and low income service employees) foot the entire bill. For those who do benefit from tourism, well they have already seen a 20% decrease in visitors and will see more reductions.

By your logic it is more than fair to assess the park service for the use of these facilities. In fact, the park service should contribute and I plan to make that recommendation to the county commissioners.

As for call and report a turtle or bird nest, etc. We always have. In fact, residents have actively worked with park service errecting fencing, taking it down, etc. Angler who fish at day break used to alert the park to turtles that the patrol would have missed otherwise. There is a long list of what we have done in suppor of wildlife and your soap box call for action makes it quite clear that you don’t have a clue as to what you are talking about.

Ginny (Email ) - 04-02-’12 10:45
Rob Beedie

Did all of us just give our rights away by not being educated, informed or just plan indifferent?

Who Knows?

Unjust laws, regulations, and rules are only passed to be overturned and if I stand alone in my thinking,so be it, and call me crazy.

I believe that, if WE THE PEOPLE, believe strong enough than we can have these most restrictive and unjust laws overturned and we should focus on doing just that together.

I believe that what we all have lost is fairly simple to define, indeed.

We all lost our rights to Life, Liberty, and Pursuit of Happiness.

Nothing more and certainly nothing less.

Now finding an honest lawyer that will advise and represent us, WE THE PEOPLE, in such a positive way, that he gets the case heard in the Federal Supreme Court of our United States.

Let the Federal Judges decide our fate as they face ‘the people’.

Our Constitutional Rights have been violated because nowhere does the law even suggest that any organization, agency, or Corporation can impose such ignorant laws on us.

Nowhere does MONEY or the lack thereof dictate who has more rights than the other.

Active Waterpersons throughout the United States and beyond should come together on the Hatteras Island Beach Access Issues now more than ever and a new Human Rights Coastal Organization should be created for the sole purpose of overturning these new laws and regulations and after it does than it can represent Active Waterpersons on other Access Issues throughout the United States and beyond.

We then become not ‘a Special Interest Group’ but ‘the SPECIAL INTEREST GROUP’ because it will grow so quickly that it will shock the status quo of yesteryear when ‘the people’ had no voice.

Listen to your own educated mind and pay close attentiion to the stirring of your soul because I know that all of you deep down inside know that these newly passed unjust laws are not only wrong but almost criminal because they openly violate so many of us and I for one will never stop speaking out against ALL THOSE THAT OPPOSE FREEDOM – my personal freedom.

The opposition, the National Park Service, The Interior Department, and our Government passed these ignorant laws knowing that through CORRUPT POWER and FINES that they could control those affected ;both, mentally, physically – by physical intimidation and force, also, by imposing financial burdens by imposing fees and fines.

I predict as more closures, fines, and prime areas are permanently closed now and in the near future that all that claim to love this area will ‘cry out’ for change that represents the people, all of us, locals and visitors alike.

It will take years to get organized but for now we should all gather together peacefully and invite literally thousands; if not, tens of thousands of Active Waterpersons together from Maine to Florida and beyond to discuss our future in regards to Beach Access and OUR RIGHTS.

Yes, it will take leadership, money, and commitment from everyone if we are serious about winning OUR FREEDOMS back short of nothing less than full restoration as they once were because it is worth fighting for and as I stated before no one, no organization or misguided individuals have the right to do what they have done to us and their, not our, unjust laws were only imposed because most everyone sat idly by on the sidelines while their rights were being taken away.

Now is not the time to ‘bitch and gripe’ about what has been done now is the time for the entire Fishing, Surfing, Kiteboarding,Tourist Industry, Hotel & Motel Industry, Gift Shops, Restaurant Association, and everyone that either loves or those that have a vested interest in the Outer Banks to come together of one accord to win your rights back.

It can and will happen, in time, if in your ‘hearts & soul’ you really want your freedoms back.

Etch this in your minds that Unjust Laws, Regulations, and Rules are passed only to be overturned.

SHAME ON ALL THOSE THAT OPPOSE FREEDOM!

In time we all will come together or accept that we have lost.

Have we lost?

I think that it may appear that we have but not for long.

Sincerely,

Rob Beedie, GSN
Global Surf Network

Rob Beedie (Email ) (URL) - 04-02-’12 12:33
Anna

I have written my Representatives concerning these rules and will continue to do so. Even to the point nagging if I have to.

I have also encouraged everyone I know to do the same.

Anna - 04-02-’12 13:43
Crotalus

Trying to figure out how destroying ecosystems and species is a constitutional freedom……

Crotalus - 04-02-’12 20:40
Willi

Crotalus stick to your online home study of shore birds and the interstitial ecology of sandy shorelines. You are lost in the sauce otherwise.

The access restrictions to the beach is very much a Constitutional issue. It’s as much of a Constitutional issue as the Affordable Care Act of March 2010. THEY ARE BOTH EXAMPLES OF THE GOVERNMENT OVERSTEPPING THE STRUCTURAL CONSTRAINTS OF THECONSTITUTION.

The Constitution never intended for a Judge to legislate from the bench but that is what happened here and that is clearly a violation of the separation of powers among other things. Additionally, because a closed area is violated, the automatic effect is for closures to increase? That is absurd. Enviro whackos have more to gain by violating boundaries than the pro access groups and that is clearly penalizing someone or a group of people without proof or due process as enumerated under the 5th and 14th amendments of our CONSTITUTION.

Furthermore, the due process CLAUSE provides that: before depriving a citizen of life, liberty or property, the government must follow fair procedures. The Consent Decree and the final rule did not come close to doing that and Dare County was essentially UNDER DURESS when agreeing to it at the eleventh hour and with tourist season approaching.

Willi - 04-02-’12 21:38
Anon2

"By your logic it is more than fair to assess the park service for the use of these facilities. In fact, the park service should contribute and I plan to make that recommendation to the county commissioners."

Ginny, you may be on to something here.

For example the city government of Washington DC receives a federal payment each year to offset the city’s loss of tax revenue from so much federally-owned land there.

Additionally, the city of DC has to provide infrastructure for all of the tourists who visit the parks and monuments and for all of the workers who live in the suburbs but use the city’s infrastructure during the workday and then split.

If the economies that support federal parkland are suffering in their effort to maintain basic services and to keep the locals employed, then maybe there is a case for a federal contribution to the island.

But I worry that if your effort with the commissioners leads to success, then those commissioners would probably vote to spend the money in Manteo on new sidewalks and bike paths there instead of on investments to our island’s year-round economy.

Anon2 - 04-02-’12 21:41
Crotalus

Willi,

Just as you don’t have "freedom" to yell "Fire" in a theater, so too are other alleged "freedoms" restricted, especially when they deprive others of rights – like the extirpation of species and ecological damage on the OBX would deprive others of their "freedoms" to observe THEIR seashore in an unimpaired state.

You still have access. 100 percent access 100 percent of the time has never been guaranteed, as even Wirth promised restrictions.

And the judicial was very much designed to be a check on the other two branches of government (see Marbury v Madison).

The automatic expansions for violations are no longer in effect, as far as I can tell.

Crotalus - 04-02-’12 21:51
bbc

From Wolf:

“I wished for all residents in that location that there was an exemption for you to have to pay. I am sorry that you have to pay. But you utilize the area the most, also.”

i beg to differ… a license plate check on any given beach will reveal mostly out of state tags. also, a lot of the NC plates are not people who live here but people who come here on vacation. visitors utilize the area the most.

bbc - 04-02-’12 22:36
bbc

what scares me is in five years when they close more beach it will be the new ‘normal’ and a few years after that they close more and it’s the new ‘normal’……until there’s nothing left.

bbc - 06-02-’12 09:16
Salco Jimmy

bbc has said in effect what I have many times said is the long term strategic goal of the environs; to eventually take control of all. Their short term tactic is to chip away a little bit at a time and they don’t care if it takes decades to reach the final goal.

Think about it. The move started back in the 1970s with banning ORVs from Pea Island beaches. It has moved slowly forward over the last 40+ yrs to where we are today.

But as bbc indicates, it ain’t over. When the plan is reviewed in 5 yrs, I seriously doubt if there will be any roll back in acces restrictions. It’s never happened in the last 40+ yrs.

Salco Jimmy (Email ) - 06-02-’12 09:34
Concerned in Buxton

It was relayed to me that frequent message board poster JAM was boasting online yesterday about his attempted intimidation of 40 “birders” and their “leader” over the weekend in the vicinity of Cape Point. The posts included very vulgar names for this group. I actually spoke to some of this group in Conner’s over the weekend….Their “leader” was a college professor from UNC and the 40 “birders” were students here for a biology lab. I find it unfortunate that these folks were stereotyped as those that led to the current NPS policy when all they were doing was participating in a mandatory part of their course. They may have known nothing of the situation, the issues, or even been opposed to beach driving. If they were on the fence, his actions probably didn’t help the cause and it definitely did not represent our island very well. Such behavior should be discouraged and not tolerated by our island residents!

Concerned in Buxton - 06-02-’12 11:12
Concerned in USA

If they didn’t know of the ‘situation’ then their professor is not doing his job. The attempted intimidation was merely positioning his vehicle so that they could see his ‘identify this audubon’ sticker. Since they were not affiliated with Auduban Society then I don’t know why they would be intimidated. If his actions inspired conversation/debate about the ‘situation’ then I think it was a positive thing…

Concerned in USA - 06-02-’12 11:47
Will

My wife is disabled. She is unable to walk in the sand and OBX is the only place that we can drive on the beach. We have been vacationing for over 10 yrs at OBX, so that she can get out on the beach and enjoy our 2 sons playing in the sand. This is a stupid rule from the NPS and crazy that we have to pay a fee to enjoy the beach. This will be our last year at OBX.

Will - 06-02-’12 13:07
JAM

If it Walks and Talks like a DUCK, chances are it’s a DUCK…Sorry If My Pink Sticker Offended You… NOT…Tell your Birder Buddies, the next time they Park In the Middle of an access RAMP (44) their White Vans Will Be Towed.. Isn’t UNC by Chapel Hill… Not know about the Issue…WOW…If you are So Concerned In Buxton, take it up with me. I am not an (ANON) as I have nothing to hide… Discourage Away, you will find out your are in the minority, People who have to HIDE are usualy up to no good…
JAM

JAM (Email ) - 06-02-’12 16:50
Fred

Does anyone have an email address for Mike Murray??

Fred - 06-02-’12 16:55
Salvo Jimmy

Here is a link to NCBBA info to folks on what is going on

http://ncbbaonline.com/news/350-february..

Salvo Jimmy (Email ) - 06-02-’12 21:18
Salvo Jimmy

Fred

mike_murray@nps.gov

underscore between the e and m

Salvo Jimmy (Email ) - 06-02-’12 21:23
hellyeahIamanonymous

JAM live and let live. If someone says they were intimidated, then they were intimidated by you. It’s up to the intimidated to define it. No wonder you’ll be hard pressed to find a dissenting view on these threads. and then who would sign their name? and it ain’t fear of a fight it’s the hassle that goes along with it.

hellyeahIamanonymous - 06-02-’12 21:59
JAM

I guess u need to re-read the post… It was all hear-say… Someone had “HEARD” that I Intimidated a Flock of Freako’s.. When in all actuality, all I did was position my truck so they could see my sticker…

If you STAND for Something, you should have no problem, signing you real name.. People who hide in a Veil of anominity, are up to no good… If you can’t stand for what you believe, or are afraid of the ramifications of your beliefs.. Maybe some Soul searching is in Order… I have never posted anything anywhere as an anon, I have also never been hassled either on or off the Internet for my beliefs….

JAM

JAM (Email ) - 07-02-’12 06:19
Pumpkinboy

Flock of Freako’s, love it!

Pumpkinboy - 07-02-’12 09:57
ANON

JAM,

You should be proud of yourself. You have made it that many think of a pro ORV access person is just like you. You certainly do not add to the cause and as a matter of fact hurt it. All are impressed with all that bravado your present. Another who has no business to lose. You do not want to address the issues, just wanting us all to believe what a “man” you are.

ANON - 07-02-’12 10:57
Hawk Hawkins

I stand with JAM and always will.The “flock of freakos” have caused great harm and deserve to have their little feelings hurt.Crotalus,you wouldn’t understand true freedom if fell on your head like a large bird doo.

Hawk Hawkins (Email ) - 07-02-’12 11:06
JAM

JAM,

You should be proud of yourself. You have made it that many think of a pro ORV access person is just like you. You certainly do not add to the cause and as a matter of fact hurt it. All are impressed with all that bravado your present. Another who has no business to lose. You do not want to address the issues, just wanting us all to believe what a “man” you are. ANON – 07 02 12 – 10:57”

Yes I am proud of what I have been able to help with, and have never turned down a request from any of the members of CHAPA. Ain’t no “BRAVADO” just me being me. No business to lose, O.K., shows how much you know, check the FEIS, I and others who have sustained loses are named right in the Document… Name an Issue I’ll address it… Again People who Need to Post as “ANON” must have something to Hide, if you can not post as who you are, your opinion means nothing to me, or anyone else…..Again I came here to Fish, they started the FIGHT, now “THEY” can “JUST DEAL WITH ME” Something very Special has been takin away from me, My FREEDOM…. I believe that is worth fighting for..
JAM

JAM (Email ) - 07-02-’12 11:35
Marty

I would hardly call a college biology class a “flock of freakos”. For all you know, some of the kids could be Republicans who like to hunt and fish. I don’t think we should label people just because they happen to be out on the beach looking at birds. For a class. That they have to take to get their degree. Personally, I like birds and turtles, just think the measures to protect a very very few birds (who could nest at Cape Lookout National Seashore) are WAY over the top. But that doesn’t mean that anyone who likes birding is at one with the SELC pests, Audobon, etc.

Marty (Email ) - 07-02-’12 12:08
Stevie T

I am very disappointed at how this ended. I have been going to Hatteras for 38 years and feel like buxton is a home away from home. However; I believe that most of you are missing the point. there is no need to battle with each other over who’s fault it was, or who’s the man. We need to try to pull together and see if there are any other options. If we fight each other and decide to never go back, the only loser will be the shop owners and residents of the island.

Stevie T (Email ) - 07-02-’12 13:08
Salvo Jimmy

ANON

JAM has no business to lose???? Shows how much you know.

He does computer work and repair on the island (his own business), builds custom rods (his own business), does kayak fishing guides (his own business) works in a tackle shop (employee).

He has plenty to loose and has lost in the past.

How about you??? Oh I forgot; that would be ANON also I guess.

Salvo Jimmy (Email ) - 07-02-’12 13:20
Crotalus

I seriously doubt someone’s going to be “intimidated” by just a bumper sticker.

Crotalus - 07-02-’12 16:45
Salvo Jimmy

Good Grief !!!!!!

I think it’s now 3 times I’ve agreed with Crot.

Help me ya’ll, please.

wink wink wink

Salvo Jimmy (Email ) - 07-02-’12 16:59
ANON

Salvo Jimmy,

Birds of feather, flock together don’t they? JAM has made it known to anyone who is silly enough to listen that he supports a ban of all NPS and environmentalists in all businesses of HI. I for one refuse to spend my hard earned money on those who take that stand. No sympathy for those people from any business loss. I can find no business address for those businesses in the phone directory or note any store front while driving around HI.

SJ, it appears to me that you are another who has a lot of bravado with no business at stake. I know that your primary residence is not HI. You might want to consider a different champion for ORV access.

ANON - 07-02-’12 17:04
AnonaMouse

Go away, Ray.

AnonaMouse - 07-02-’12 17:20
bbc

as a buxton business owner i have lost and stand to lose a lot more……thanks all…….last comment from me

bbc - 07-02-’12 18:30
Salvo Jimmy

Well ANON

Tell me how pointing out your error about JAM and business constitutes any support or non-support for him. You have no clue whether I support him or not. You are presuming. I have also not said whether I support or don’t support a NPS business boycott. There you infer.

Of course you can’t find a store front for some of JAM’s business because it is home based. I think you can find a store front where he is an employee.

No I don’t have a business interest per se on HI but I have owned a house there for 40+ yrs and spend about 40% of my time there. I don’t rent my place but I do fear a real drop in property value that could well result from the current restrictions and further restrictions I believe may come in the future. That would definitely hurt in my wife an I’s declining yrs.

And yes my primary residence is not on HI even though I’m a native Tar Heel. It is in Hampton VA because as retired Navy that area contains the benefits I am eligible for from my service. Had the SOSUS base in Buxton not closed my primary residence might well be Salvo.

My immediate loss is not being able to enjoy the retirement I envisioned on HI since I have lost the ability to get to some favorite spots much of the year, to wit Cape Point, Inlet Spits, the South Beach and Ramp 23.

As far a bravado, you bet. As a 24 yr veteran of submarines having had command of a nuclear powered, nuclear weapon capable sub, I don’t subscribe to political correctness or civilian sensitivity concepts. I tell it like I see it and am not very concerned who about who is offended by my opinions or beliefs. I also don’t hide behind ANON. On forums where a signature is allowed anyone can see who I am and can look at my profile.

Now ANON lets hear a lirttle about you because I’m having a hard time deciding where on the scale of ignoraNus to genius you fit. I’m leaning toward the former due to lack of info and your presumptive / inferences posts about what / who I support.

Salvo Jimmy (Email ) - 07-02-’12 21:05
Crotalus

Point of order,

SJ, how do I know your name’s really “Salvo Jimmy”? Neither your home address or telephone number is associated with that name. Even after almost 4 years, you’re just as anonymous to me as is “ANON”.

Crotalus - 07-02-’12 22:21
ANON

Salvo,

Well, do you support JAMs actions and do you support a ban on NPS personnel for HI businesses? If JAMs businesses have no store front or employees to worry about, then what gives him (or you?) the right to such bravado as to ask building/employee business owners to refuse service to the NPS?

As a side note, your military service is commendable, but little to do with the issue. I and many have served, but let’s keep the war stories for another time.

ANON - 07-02-’12 23:11
JAM

Hey Ray, the business ban went NO-WHERE, if it were implemented 10 years ago we would not be where we are at right now.. There are too many FENCE Sitters for it to have ever worked. Ms. Dillon has done it since then, and it has not hurt her business in any way..Your a trip man, you had your chance to STEP UP 2 years ago at the Public Comment Period at the Cape Hatteras School…. Guess what YOU DIDN“T … I’ll send you an e-mail so you can become my friend on FACEBOOK, this way you can see what I had for breakfast today… Hows that Piucture of ME holding a DRUM in you Garage workin out for you.. If your opinions are so popular, why hide, step up, be a man.. BTW I can only control what I OWN, and I won’t be fixin any NPS employees computer, and I dam sure will not be taking them KAYAKING…… Dam, your more interested in me and my life then My MOM, SCAREY, but I guess that why they Issue CCW permits…

JAM ON IT

JAM (Email ) - 08-02-’12 07:19
Anothanon

Anyone know why the SOSUS base in Buxton can’t be used for beach parking or for a new hotel or some othe amendities? Could some good use be made of that?

Anothanon - 08-02-’12 12:23
Salvo Jimmy

ANON,

I don’t feel obligated to give you as an ANON any further info on what I think of a ban on NPS employees or any other issue. The military service info was in response to your bravado comment; background on bravado, nothing more.

I will say I think JAM made a mistake in the sticker thing by not calling in the apparent blocked / impeded ramp if that was actually the case. I would have done that and would do it anytime, as I have done, regardless of what side of the access fence the person might be on.

I will no longer dialogue with you until you come out of the closet, except maybe to point out obvious errors in your posts.

Lastly, Sub Dolphin Code 175 to you. Translation; “Go s – - t in your hat.” Then put it on your head.

CROT,

You know full well (or have access to ) my full name, residence location(s) and background from another board you frequent where there is a profile and signature. BUT just in case you are that dense:

Ted A. Hamilton
Hampton VA primary residence
Salvo NC secondary residence
Retired submariner
Interest: Surf fishin’ / pistol shooting

Exact addresses and phone numbers are irrelavent to actual ID / background

And BTW any folks attending Reg-Neg know full well who I am as I always wore my Salvo Jimmy hat and made in person public comments (with the hat on) at all but 2 meetings. One I could not attend and the other I gave up my time to another person who needed more time.

To you Sub Dolphin Code 130 Translation (a little paraphrased) “Bloody h _ _ _, he’s at it again.”

Now, for both of you ANONs lets see if you are willing to provide equivalent actual ID / background info.

Finally

Submariners never lie but we are sneaky, devious, covert individuals who cheat like h _ _ _, don’t fight fair and have no problem waiting for you to pass by, then shooting you up the backside where you are most vulnerable and least expect it. Followed by running away to wait for the next unsuspecting target. We were stealth fighters long before the aircraft concept was developed. Just more background on bravado.

Salvo Jimmy (Email ) - 08-02-’12 12:45
Salvo Jimmy

Anothanon

Last I recall and I think it was here on IFP (maybe OBX Voice), an outfit from VA Bch has purchased the housing area from the CG with plans to turn the housing into short and long term rentals.

Salvo Jimmy (Email ) - 08-02-’12 12:50
enough is enough

JAM,
If “me being me” is to give an obscene middle finger in view of every local and visitor and child and grandmother via billboards and bumper stickers, then you should be ashamed of yourself…just like the female rap singer on the Superbowl. You haven’t solved the problem, you have just become another problem that will hurt HI’s reputation.

enough is enough - 08-02-’12 12:56
marsh rabbit

Again, why in the heck would anyone want to vacation on an island where folks are angry and hostile, giving the finger, and banning people? The situation is what it is, so now the island needs to figure out how to deal with the new reality. Yes, the new regs are lousy, but it could be a very long time, if ever, before they get changed.

marsh rabbit - 08-02-’12 13:31
Crotalus

SJ,
Your name and locations still mean nothing to me (I’ve never looked at the other board).

I’m John Smith of Asheville and Buxton. That mean anything to you? Does it change the veracity of anything I say?

If someone makes a claim, one should investigate the claim, not the person making it. The first will get to the truth, the second is irrelevant and borders on stalking and psychosis.

Crotalus - 08-02-’12 17:41
Ginny

SJ,
Your name and locations still mean nothing to me (I’ve never looked at the other board).

I’m John Smith of Asheville and Buxton. That mean anything to you? Does it change the veracity of anything I say?

If someone makes a claim, one should investigate the claim, not the person making it. The first will get to the truth, the second is irrelevant and borders on stalking and psychosis.
Crotalus – 08 02 12 – 17:41

I know you know how to do an internet search. That and you have seen many pictures of Salvo, Jam, and me on the internet. You are just trying to be a pain in the touch!

Ginny (Email ) - 08-02-’12 19:22
Crotalus

Ginny,
Again, I’ve never looked because, unless he’s claiming to be a subject expert with a lot of published lit, it doesn’t matter who SJ is (or the dozens of others posting). I’ve purchased bait and rods from JAM, so I know who he is, and have seen you around town and the beach, not that who you are matters. I simply do not care.

Crotalus - 08-02-’12 20:16
Joe (not anon)

SJ,

Looks like you are trying to do a little sidestep and use a thin excuse for not answering the question presented. As Crotalus said “Who cares”. Whoever you are have some guts and answer the questions asked. I attended the FEIS meeting in Buxton and did not see you or your hat and certainly did not hear JAM voice any of his toughts on beach access at that meeting.

I was in the Navy and all the submariners I knew always started off saying this is the truth and we immediately knew that it was a lie.

Joe (not anon) - 08-02-’12 20:50
pumkinboy

joe Crot if you spend anytime on Hatteras Island, you will get to know “Salvo Jimmy”, and I recommend it. You will be richer for the experience

pumkinboy - 08-02-’12 23:20
Joe

RE: Joe (not anon) – 08 02 12 – 20:50

For the record and to avoid confusion with the other ‘Joe’ alias above, my alias ‘Joe’ of much earlier posts: Joe – 02 02 12 – 12:42 , Joe – 02 02 12 – 13:14, and Joe – 03 02 12 – 09:29 in this thread, never attended any FEIS meeting and was never in the Navy. I don’t think I have ever met JAM, although it would probably be a pleasure, and I have also never met a submariner that was not honorable.

You know, I see such a waste of time and effort in the senseless verbal sparring and games I see played here. If only all this same energy and intellect could have been focused in some constructive solution that would have allowed reasonable beach access for all, protected the wildlife, enhanced tourism, and helped make business boom on the Inland, it could have been a win-win-win-win for all parties involved. But since thoughtful and prudent compromises were not reached for whatever reason, we are now only left with much division and much bitterness, as can be witnessed in many of the posts here on this blog. What a shame.

Public Notice- Since someone else here also wants to use ‘Joe’ as an alias, they are welcome to it. I won’t be using it or any variation of it, any longer after this post.

Joe - 09-02-’12 03:18
David DeVries

Very sad, for over 2 1/2 decades we have been going to Hatteras or Ocracoke in the fall and spring. After the Irene fiasco and now the driving restrictions (which were bad enough already) My wife and I have reluctantly decided that we will make no more trips to OBX. As usual the minority of eco-nazi’s have decided for the majority once again. Their goal is to make Hatteras and Ocracoke another Portsmouth Is. Very, very sad. I wish my friends on Hatteras the best of luck in whatever future is left for the island.

David DeVries - 09-02-’12 09:10
Crotalus

David DeVries,

Congress (the people) passed the Organic Act, Congress (the people) passed the ESA, Congress (the people) passed NEPA, so The People are said "eco-nazis" as all the groups targeted by your invective have done, is to demand the Feds follow the law.

If you think the majority of The People no longer care about protecting species and the environment on their lands, it should be easy to get all of the above repealed and everyone can go back to destruction as usual.

Just an observation. Driving restrictions elsewhere haven’t turned those locations into another Portsmouth Is.

Crotalus - 09-02-’12 10:35
Steve

FWIW, we’ll keep coming down to HI in spite of the closures. My dad first started coming down in the 50’s and our family in it’s 3rd generation makes annual trips now. We’ll fish and walk the beach where we’re allowed and take what we can, it’s still a great place to visit and we do plan on living permanently there within the decade.

I’ll keep patronizing the local businesses like Hatteras Jacks and Risky Business seafood. Dewey, we’ll stop by and check out your shop next time we’re down, my wife loves those kind of places.

I understand the anger and frustration that goes along with this but would encourage you to keep a cool head and not just go ‘full automatic’ at what may be perceived as a convenient target. Residents and visitors desperately need the support of people whose only knowledge of the Outer Banks or Hatteras Island are the oval OBX or HI stickers seen on someones rear window. They need to be turned on to the cause of open beaches and not turned off.

Don’t give up on OBPA or NCBBA, they are certainly not in the same league as the SELC but giving what they can. Who else do you have to support beach access without them?

One final point, wait to see what enforcement brings when the regs go into effect. Quite often enforcement is soft, the agency can only do what their budget and manpower allows them to do.

Steve (Email ) - 09-02-’12 12:00
Salvo Jimmy

Sorry Joe (not anon) I will neither confirm nor denigh. BTW I think you mean the DEIS mtg. NO I was not in Buxton. Attended the one in Hampton, knowing Buxton would get good attendance, but maybe Hampton would not.

Gee Crot if you have not looked at the other board, how come I see a post of yours there today.

I’m out of here on this blog. As Joe (the public notice one) implies, it has become a waste of time.

BTW all need to take a look at the story on IFP about the CHAPA lawsuit. Hope we win this one.

Salvo Jimmy (Email ) - 09-02-’12 19:00
Irene

I agree that this blog is about done….Will be posting a new one soon. Meanwhile, see story on Beach Access Page about CHAPA lawsuit to stop the NPS ORV plan/rule.

http://islandfreepress.org/2012Archives/..

Irene - 09-02-’12 19:11
Charlene

Dear Hatteras, You are your own worse enemy. Who would want to visit HI with all the nasty signs, angry people and businesses who are selective in deciding who and who does not enter? I think Hatteras needs to take a look at itself. I have a local OBX business (not in Hatteras), and we had the best year ever last year. I understand that some businesses will be hurt by reduced ORV traffic, and I’m sorry about that. But come on! It costs more to fish on a chartered fishing boat than it does to buy an annual permit. There are still plenty of shoreline open. And what’s wrong with accessing the beach on foot? Remember Hatteras, there are still beaches open. You make it sound like all the beaches are closed. Again, who would want to go?

Charlene (Email ) - 09-02-’12 19:24
Crotalus

Salvo Jimmy,

The comment was about I don’t nose into people’s profile information on the other board. Thanks.

Crotalus - 09-02-’12 20:49
enough is enough

Superbowl singer faces legal issues for giving the public an obscene gesture. Fair warning to those selling and displaying the middle finger on Hatteras for every young child to see. The majority of people are embarassed by these signs. Find a better way to protest.

enough is enough - 10-02-’12 09:24
Pumpkinboy

you find my sticker offense, i find the Autoban Society offensive. To each is own

Pumpkinboy - 10-02-’12 09:56
haha

Starting to sound as if the "middle finger sticker" is getting very popular on the island as people finally are becoming aware of the how impacting the new rule is going to be. I used to think the sticker was over top and didn’t want any part of it. But I as learned more about the issues, I bought three and proudly display it on my vehicle.

haha - 10-02-’12 10:05
Crotalus

The only problem is the “finger” should say “Voters Identify This Bird” because all Audubon/DoW/SELC did was ask the NPS to follow the will of the people as was reflected in the acts passed by Congress.

Crotalus - 10-02-’12 11:32
Pumpkinboy

aw come on crot, you’re not even trying anymore

Pumpkinboy - 10-02-’12 11:56
haha

I think its obvious, its not the will of the people. Its been the will of environmental special interest groups and environmental lobbyists. They have been restricting freedoms and killing jobs all over the country and the people are sick of it!

haha - 10-02-’12 12:54
Wonkette

 
Congressional Will ≠ Popular Will (e.g. ACHA)

Wonkette - 10-02-’12 13:52
Crotalus

Wonkette,
Seeing how they keep getting re-elected, I beg to differ. ACHA? American Coon Hunters Association?

Crotalus (Email ) - 10-02-’12 18:16
Hawk Hawkins

Crot,if you think congress is “the people”,then you think politians are “honest”.I don’t think you are that ignorant seeing as how you come from a superior race of intellectual anonymous aliens.We thank you,as always,for shining your light down on us poor,ignorant,knuckle dragging “Coon Hunters”.

Hawk Hawkins (Email ) - 11-02-’12 17:40
Rick

I live in KDH and have been a resident since 1984. I often drive south to all locations for work and play trying to combine the two when I can. I have never been the full time fisherman but, I do my share. One of my observations is the flavor of the Hatteras Seashore area, I’ll be heading down and stop in Rodanthe on my way to Buxton or Hatteras Village and find it so exciting to see when lots of cars and trucks packed and getting ready for a big day of fishing somewhere on the beach. If this starts to go away it will be the end of a long tradition of one of the best vacation spots in our country. I cannot tell you how disappointed I am with what the environmental groups and the FPS have done with their power over the people and their homes and investments of a lifetime. This is absolutely insane, save the widelife ( which they think they know how to do, but cannot ) at the cost of an entire population of a beautiful once free area. A Mad Signman, Rick

Rick (Email ) - 15-02-’12 08:27
victoria

We have been vacationing in Hatteras Village for more than ten years, now. It its truly a magical place. The hardships faced by local businesses is heartbreaking. I just want you to know that we will continue to vacation in Hatteras and continue to shop in local stores. We, at least, are one family who fell in love with Hatteras without ever driving on the beach. We have always walked, fished, collected shells, watched dolphins and swam without an ORV. After reading these comments, it almost looks like we’ve missed the best part. I just want to say that without ORVs, Hatteras is still our favorite place!

victoria (Email ) - 17-02-’12 07:36
The Miller Family

Dewey & Mary, Thank you for your post above. I appreciated every point you articulated and agree with each point you made. And, as saddened and frustrated by the recent decisions as our family is…we will still be coming to HI for our annual vacation…and it would NOT be a complete trip without a stop at the Old Gray House! My kids love coming to your little business…they talk about going to "the shell shop" for months prior to our trip and upon our arrival bug us daily until we have made a stop to visit you. It is one of the highlights of our trip…right up there with boogie boarding and cooking hotdogs for dinner on the beach at Frisco! I, personally, have enjoyed my conversations with you about the various specimin shells and appreciate your help picking out the best one to add to my collection. Not to worry…our trip is already planned for this summer and we will be sure to stop by for our annual visit to your lovely shop!

The Miller Family (Email ) - 24-02-’12 08:07
bridesmaid

good

bridesmaid (Email ) (URL) - 06-03-’12 00:21




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